Thieves on Ebay!!!

constantsorrow · Post by **constantsorrow** » Wed Mar 17, 2004 1:00 am

Some times ago, I've received in a trade a wonderful recording of the Reykjavik 1988 concert on 3 CDR. I've decided to encode my recording to a lossless format (SHN) and trade it. Since that days, the recordings has been widely circulating (for FREE). But I just discovered that a seller on EBAY has sold the recording many times since last month (it's the period the recording began to circulate more intensively due to a broadband trade website "Sharing The Groove", I guess he got the recording from there):

so here are the final prices:

1-55$US
2-55$US
3-101$US
4-137$US
5-86$US

this asshole got more than 434$ for that recording in CDR (supposed to be free)!!!

I've reported the seller to EBAY today but don't know if they will move and close the auction. I hope so. PLEASE DON'T BUY FROM THIS SELLER BECAUSE YOU CAN HAVE IT FOR FREE! The seller ID is bobhughes99. While I'm writing this message the item is still for auction and the current price is ~29$US.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... gory=43652

I'm really shocked and and would like to know if there's something we can do. Should we write to Leonard Cohen managment?

tomsakic · Post by **tomsakic** » Thu Mar 18, 2004 5:21 pm

I hope that Sony's letter to ebay will solve the problem.
By the way, why in any case to buy bootlegs when everyone can get better recordings free on CDRs in trade? I know that everyone doesn't have access to anyone having the shows, but at least they can try instead of buy it for 20$.

constantsorrow · Post by **constantsorrow** » Fri Mar 19, 2004 1:31 am

After furthur investigation I found that this seller sold the Reykjavik recording, since last month, at least 9 times, for a total of 446GBP or 818USD!

As Tom said, I'm wondering why people are willing to pay high prices for CD-R copies available in the trading circuit.

Moonlight · Post by **Moonlight** » Sat Mar 20, 2004 6:34 am

Hello contstant sorrow,

I am interested in the lossless format. I went to a couple of sites to find out more about it. But I couldn't make heads or tails out of the instructions. They seemed to be designed for the more technically adept. Could you clue me in? Or if this would take too much of your time (I totally understand) could you please point me to a website that does a good job of explaing how to go about encoding SHN. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

M

constantsorrow · Post by **constantsorrow** » Sat Mar 20, 2004 7:42 pm

Hello moonlight!
Actually, SHN stuff is not very complicated. If you know who to convert WAV to MP3 you'll know This message has been classified as spam and will be deleted by the moderators SHN

First thing you have to do, is to converte the music to WAV format, you can have to extract your CDs to WAV. I recommend you to use "Exact Audio Copy" (EAC) it's the best CD ripper out there! http://www.exactaudiocopy.de/

So now you have your WAV files on your computer and you need a software to convert them to SHN! Most people use "mkwACT". The last version is the 0.97 beta 1 and it is the last one because the conceptor is dead. http://home.att.net/~mkw/mkwact.html

When you're converting WAV to SHN the little program mkwACT creates at the same time a file with the extension .md5. This file is a checksum and can guarantee you the integrity of your SHN. When you double-click on the .md5, it will run mkwACT to perform a scan of your SHN and will let you know if there is a problem with the SHN. So you can copy a thousand time the SHN files and distribute them to a thousand people, as long as they match with the original .md5 you are 100% sure they are identical to the original SHN and WAV.

Here's a link to a good FAQ http://research.umbc.edu/~hamilton/shnfaq.html

But please remember: only high quality recording with a known source and lineage should be encoded to SHN or FLAC. Some people don't like when SHNs were encoded from unknown CDR generation because with each CD extraction (DAE, "disc audio extraction") you loose a little bit of quality and you multiply the chance of getting a flawed recording). Personally, I like when the SHNs come directly from the taper, so it means you have a clone of the master!

When you encode a show, you must include a text file (in the same folder as the SHN files) containing all the informations about te recording: date, venue, location, source, setlist, flaws, etc. Here's an example :

Leonard Cohen
The Complex Studios
Los Angeles, CA, USA
April 18, 1993
Pre-tour concert

Liberated bootleg "First We Take L.A., Than We Take Berlin", Venus Music, VM 010

Source: FM > ? > Original Silverpressed CD > EAC (secure) > SHN (mkwACT)

01 First We Take Manhattan
02 Ain't No Cure For Love
03 Coming Back To You
04 Dance Me To The End Of Love
05 Democracy
06 Waiting For The Miracle
07 The Future
08 I'm Your Man

[filler: Spektrum, Oslo, Norway, May 1, 1993]

09 Bird On The Wire
10 Everybody Knows
11 Avalanche
12 Suzanne
13 Tower Of Song
14 I Can't Forget

Notes: filler is incomplete.
Requires 1X80min for audio.

compiled by livecohen@hotmail.com

Source: FM > ? > Original Silverpressed CD > EAC (secure) > SHN (mkwACT) .... It means that everyone with the SHN has a 1st gen. copy from the silver disc! That's what is good about SHN, it stops the generation process!

I don't know if it's clearer for you but if you have any question let me know.

Moonlight · Post by **Moonlight** » Sat Mar 20, 2004 8:58 pm

Hello Constant Sorrow,

Thanks very MUCH! That was exactly the information I needed. I appreciate the time and effort you took to do this. You explained it in way that I could understand it. That is a rare gift.

I am going to try and work on it this weekend. I will let you know how I make out. Thanks again for all the trouble you took.

M

constantsorrow · Post by **constantsorrow** » Sat Mar 20, 2004 11:23 pm

No problem! I'm always happy to help

justinburnett · Post by **justinburnett** » Wed Oct 27, 2004 9:45 pm

Opportunists are always with us. I've often wished that I had less scruples, since I could have made a fortune selling copies of the various live recordings I've amassed over the years. It's really quite frustrating. Every so often, I'll e-mail the bidders on those Ebay auctions and tell them where the recording they're buying is available for free, but there are just so many. Many people just don't seem to realize that the trading community exists, or perhaps they're just too lazy and have more money than time. Sad.

Take care
-J-

Paula · Post by **Paula** » Thu Oct 28, 2004 12:17 am

I have emailed ebay on countless occasions to bring sellers to their attention. I am of the opinion they don't give a flying f***. If it wasn't for bad feedback I would bid a ridiculous amount for the CDs just to p*** them off. It is soul destroying that things that have either been given for free on this web site or other sites are so blatently sold on Ebay.

margaret · Post by **margaret** » Thu Oct 28, 2004 9:10 pm

I think it's getting worse on Ebay since more has become available from sources like the FTP site. There are big profits now being made by people mass producing cdr's and dvd's

tomsakic · Post by **tomsakic** » Tue Jan 04, 2005 12:14 pm

Somebody on eBay is selling Hannover 1979 soundboard on two CDRs. It's the tape I got from Jim Devlin and Arturo in Poland tranferred it into the CDRs. Sad. You feel much more cheated when you know it's the CD you & your friends made for free circulation.

lizzytysh · Post by **lizzytysh** » Tue Jan 04, 2005 4:39 pm

Does it still work to bid outrageously to do them out of their ill-gotten monies?

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Wed Jan 05, 2005 12:56 pm

Many of us are irritated by the e-bay profiteers.

Tom, how about "How can I access Leonard Cohen bootlegs?" for FAQ.
That should cut down the business considerably.

Rob.

jurica · Post by **jurica** » Wed Jan 05, 2005 1:28 pm

tom and i already discussed this question, and i agree it should be included in FAQ. i'm only not sure weather to iclude it in FAQ or LFAQ... if FAQ is for newbies, one can expect them not to have all studio recordings yet, so what's the use for bootlegs?

but on the other hand, someone may be more interested in bootlegs than studio recordings. then comes the question of morality. are we stealing from Cohen if we help them get bootlegs before studio stuff?

then there are thieves on E-Bay who we need to stop...

too complicated for poor ol' me. someone please help.

lizzytysh · Post by **lizzytysh** » Wed Jan 05, 2005 2:11 pm

I agree that it should be in the FAQ section. If it cuts them [profiteers] off at the pass, then we'll have done the right thing. I don't believe that 'bootlegs' will gouge legitimate sales of studio albums. They're so different.