Do Leonard Cohen Fans Favor Sad Songs?

[Fljotsdale]

Y'know, it's funny - but I never felt the least need to analyse Cohen's songs.

Oh, of course, they leave you with impressions - and the impressions often change as I hear them over and over again - but an analysis? - a 'what did he mean by that?' - no.

The words and music - for me - speak directly, inside me, and meaning is felt, not analysed...

But that's just me, I guess.

But I like reading what other people think.

[rayc]

Hi all,

I do like sad songs but prefer melancholy ones.
Nick Cave over Janis Ian
I like angry songs but prefer bitter ones.
Elvis Costello over the Birthday party
I like rebellious songs but prefer satirical ones.
Nirvana over the Clash
I like happy songs but prefer jubillant ones.
Sugarcubes over Slade
I like complex songs but prefer obscure ones.
Velvet Underground over Rodriguez
I like sentimental songs but prefer sad ones........

I really like all of the above as they surface in Lenny songs often only after repeated listenings or in that crystalline moment when hearing without listening & something shines through grabbing my attention & altering my perspective.

In other words, like most of you "it depends".
Cheers
rayc

[yellowhe]

Leonard Cohen's melancoly doesn't have much to do with unhappiness nor with real self hate, maybe not even with black sadness.
Even when I feel some kind of little or big "blues", LC's music and poetry make me feel good or at least better contrary to a dead and estimated singer Jacques Brel who gave me every time I heard him the unpleasant feelin that he hated himself and used to change his sadness into agressivity.
LC's songs make me feel good even when I'm not so good.

[Shane]

Sad songs, yes.

[johnny7moons]

have you folks heard nick cave's lecture-on-cd 'the secret life of the love song'? if not, check it out. he makes a very articulate and very moving case for the right to be sad, and of course pays tribute to leonard as one of the masters of sadness.

[Shane]

have you folks heard nick cave's lecture-on-cd 'the secret life of the love song'? if not, check it out. he makes a very articulate and very moving case for the right to be sad, and of course pays tribute to leonard as one of the masters of sadness.

I second this.

How he storms through "West Country Girl" in the very beginning is simply stunning. "Sad Waters" and "Far From Me" are also beautiful.

He is truly one of the greats.

This week my girl and I got another Cave related tattoo done... Mine reads Your Funeral and hers My Trial.

[lizzytysh]

Hi Johnny ~

I won't quote your whole posting, as it's all relevant and this cd sounds very worthwhile. I'll check into getting it ~ perhaps, on ebay or another, similar site? A very interesting thing for him to have done.

~ Lizzy

[YankovicGretzky]

I favor the funny and political Cohen: Hallelujah, Everybody Knows, First We Take Manhatten, The Future, Democracy, Waiting For The Miracle, Closing Time; et cetera!

[lightning]

Yellowhe from Liege, Belgium,
You are the first Belgian I ever heard of who didn't appreciate Brel, except for the Flamigants whom he attacked ( are you one?) and the Flamandes, whom he satirized so viciously they were probably glad when he died. His song for Liege, "Il neige sur Liege" is very Cohen like, though not Brel's favorite. It is soft and beautiful and always made me want to visit Liege in the snow.
Drink that great Belgian Bière, eat those chocolate Bonbons and enjoy Brel, your greatest national treasure!

[Tchocolatl]

"Il neige il neige sur Liège
Et la neige sur Liège pour neiger met des gants"

Thanks Ligthning to have direct my attention on this song.

I don't know all Jacques Brel's body of work yet.

As a song writer and poet, yes, he and Cohen have some very similar sides. They both create stunning beautiful poetic images, very deep in emotion, with nothing weak (as the taboo about men's emotion can run sometimes). They are expressing "viril" emotion, I mean, they are themselves without affectation, men who express emotion (who are alive, not cold fishes, not already dead souls in a still living poor body - not zombies : real men), this is strongly appealing.

For the rest, Brel does not give this impression of intimacy, and of being able to sooth all the pain in the world with his voice, like Cohen does.

[lightning]

For intimacy,try listening to "Jef" , "Chanson des Vieux Amants" and "JoJo" for example. You are lucky to be able to listen in French without translation.

[Tchocolatl]

La Chanson des Vieux Amants is very well known, it plays often (relatively) on the radio. Very beautiful. I heard "Jeff" and "Jojo" about two years ago at a tribute show - very good (the chanteur got a standing ov. at the end and most attendents seem to know all the songs).

I like very much how the real Brel sings Orly, it is awfully beautifully sad. A pure moment of pain in real life captured - a deep portrait without shame or affectation - very true, very just. Well then, yet. For me, it rests that they have not the same energy. But all this is very personal, so....

You know the fact that you have to translate, far from being a non-luck, may add a touch of emotion. And mystery. A touch of pleasure, then. I'm very found of translations when they are respectful of the original. When it is well done, it could shed a light from a different angle, and although it shows the same thing, I see it again in a different way. But again, this is very personal.

I like Aznavour also for the quality of emotion. But this is all another energy not like Brel and Cohen. A B C

[lightning]

North America's DRG label just re-released 4 Brel Albums for about half the price of the European imports:
Infiniment ( 2 CDs, best of plus unreleased tracks), Next, big name cover versions ( Nina Simone, Dusty Springfield, David Bowie, Scott Walker etc), mostly in English, L'homme de la Mancha, Brel's Don Quixote, translation of the American musical theatre smash hit musical, and most recently, Olympia, '61 & '64,a 2 CD live in concert set. I had the luck to write the liner notes and rework the booklets with short English translations of all songs on the 2CD sets. They are enough to give you some idea of what the song is about, then, if you know a bit of French, you can pursue a fuller translation with lyrics from the internet and your own dictionary.
Brel is one of the greatest singer/songwriters of modern times, predecessor of Leonard Cohen, and I think everyone who visits this board will enjoy listening to him.

[lizzytysh]

I was delighted and enjoyed my discovery of him 20 years ago, but have come to appreciate him immensely more since meeting you, Lightning, and as a result listening to more of him, and seeing/hearing footage of him. I can't relate, at all, to what yellowhe is saying about self-hate with him. His style was certainly intense, though....but that's part of what gives his performances and singing so much character. I agree that there's a Brel-Cohen link that would make a crossover by those here very easy.

Welcome to the Forum, yellowhe , even if I don't share your perspective on Brel .

~ Lizzy

[Tchocolatl]

(...)Brel is one of the greatest singer/songwriters of modern times (...)

Heis. No doubt.

And yes I'm lucky to have direct access to his poetry. There is a "Complete Brel" on the market right now in French : songs, booklet and tutti quanti.

Although Aznavour does not write his songs, he renders them with the same quality in the emotion that a singer doubled with an actor can do. I think Brel and Cohen have this quality, to be able to act a song, when they are singing it, also.

I never liked the whole body of work of an artist. Any of them, and Cohen is not an exception, but I prefer to hear Cohen much more than Brel.

This said, he certainly is "something" that worth to be discovered, for people who does not know him yet.