leonardcohenforum.com

This month's Paste Magazine mentions a new book call Apocalypse Jukebox: The End of the World in American Popular Music by authors, David Janssen and Edward Whitelock, two English Professors at Gordon College in Barnesville, GA. After examining the musical fixations of cult leaders, Charles Manson & David Koresh, the authors devote chapters to "the four horsemen of the apocalyse," Bob Dylan, John Coltrane, Leonard Cohen and Harry Smith.

Quotes:

Dylan: "A fascination with death is discernible even with a cursory glance at the song titles from Dylan's debut: "See that My Grave is Kept Clean." The authors write: "Though these are not his compositions, his choice of material on the first album still provides a glimpse of an apocalyptic aesthetic that is perhaps the defining element of both the content and style of Dylan's own songs, from 1963's The Freewheelin' Bob Dylan to Modern Times.

Cohen: "Cohen works beyond cliche and has, from the start, understood the seemingly innocuous link between individual love and world-scale apocalyse."

Joe

Very interesting, Joe. I wish they'd said more about Leonard than that, but very interesting, nonetheless.


~ Lizzy

Perhaps I am too jaundiced, but to me this smells like a case of two idle academics, desperate to publish something to justify their salaries, twisting facts to fit a sexy theory rustled up between cocktails.

"...The seemingly innocuous link between individual love and world-scale apocalyse"? Give us a break, please. This sort of talk is pure Anthony Cher from Bradbury's The History Man.

The Future is the only song I can think of that could be deemed to be about 'world-scale apocalypse'. The most common of Leonard's themes, on the contrary, is personal apocalypse ... and at portraying that he is the Master.

You're not too jaundiced, hydriot, I think you've nailed their academic laziness / opportunism - you're spot on.

Hydriot and Nick:

You are quick to accuse me and my co-writer of laziness and idleness, yet you seem to be basing your assessment of our book upon you having read one quoted sentence reprinted in a popular magazine! Maybe that's why we're academics: we read the primary materials before forming (or publishing) opinions. Hardly a lazy nor idle undertaking.

I welcome you to actually read our book. You might find some interesting insights therein, none-the-least of which is that we treat Cohen's work primarily as an example of personal apocalypse!

Welcome to the forum Edward.

You see my problem is this. Your title is The End of the World in American Popular Music and then you go on to name four Horsemen of the Apocalypse, one of which is Leonard. But Leonard isn't American. So what is he doing in your book at all?

And why do you choose those four? The suspicion is that you just chose four of your personal favourites, because they would be easy to write about. If that is not the case, then kindly give me the list of all musicians you originally considered for the post of Horseman before whittling them down to those four.

And how can anyone suggest Dylan has anything to do with apocalypse? For every A Hard Rains A'Gonna Fall I'll name you two songs that are non-apocalyptic. Dylan rarely writes about death.

Then there is a problem with specialism. You are English academics, but you are writing outside your subject area. Your book is Sociology. Don't you think that is a tiny bit self-indulgent? Please limit your book-writing to literary criticism, which is what you are trained to do and paid to do, and leave sociology to qualified sociologists.

Finally, you know nothing about me, yet you comment snidely about 'primary sources' as if I were a layman. In fact I am a published author, and my ex-wife did her doctorate in English Literature at Oxford University ... where I can assure you the highest standards of academic rigour are maintained.

hydriot wrote:Perhaps I am too jaundiced, but to me this smells like a case of two idle academics, desperate to publish something to justify their salaries, twisting facts to fit a sexy theory rustled up between cocktails.

"...The seemingly innocuous link between individual love and world-scale apocalyse"? Give us a break, please. This sort of talk is pure Anthony Cher from Bradbury's The History Man.

The Future is the only song I can think of that could be deemed to be about 'world-scale apocalypse'. The most common of Leonard's themes, on the contrary, is personal apocalypse ... and at portraying that he is the Master.

I would definitely include Closing Time in the apocalyptic (sp>) catagory.
Daevid

The complete chapter about Leonard Cohen is available now at Google Books (p. 129 - 153):
http://books.google.ru/books?id=OeUqpyM ... &q&f=false

If I may introduce my 2 cents..
While I do not really believe in attaching labels such as "Horseman of Apocalypse"to any artist of depth (and it's a very broad definition, methinks), I do recall newspaper articles of an infamous era regarding publishing of Pasternak's "Doctor Zhivago" which started with the phrase unique in it's absurdity:
I haven't read the novel, but I condemn it..

hydriot wrote:

Dylan rarely writes about death.

I disagree respectfully and completely with this statement. The man is very cynical of life, atleast in song I dont know him personally so cant say beyond that. A very substantial number of his songs deal with this cynicism of life and living. And off the top of my head some of the most obvious lines

"In this version of death called life" (Huck's Tune)

"In death you face life with a child and a wife" (No Time to think)

"I live in another world where life and death are memorized" (Dark Eyes)

"Life is in mirrors, death disappears" (Political world)

and from Not Dark Yet I copy:

"Well, my sense of humanity has gone down the drain
Behind every beautiful thing there’s been some kind of pain
...
I’ve been down on the bottom of a world full of lies
I ain’t looking for nothing in anyone’s eyes
Sometimes my burden seems more than I can bear
It’s not dark yet, but it’s getting there

I was born here and I’ll die here against my will
I know it looks like I’m moving, but I’m standing still
Every nerve in my body is so vacant and numb
I can’t even remember what it was I came here to get away from
Don’t even hear a murmur of a prayer
It’s not dark yet, but it’s getting there"