leonardcohenforum.com

A lot of artists allow recording of their shows, some even allow you to plug right in to their soundboard. Where most artists have a problem is when people turn around and sell those recordings on Ebay, etc.

where is tonight's setlist?

zintman61 wrote:I wouldn't worry too much about bootleggers these days,it's mostly just the fans who bother to film/tape anymore...with the intent of sharing.

Yes, but there are still arguments against fan taping and not-for-profit sharing. The first of these is that if a fan makes a live recording available for free and an official live album is later released, fewer people will then go out and buy the album, thereby depriving the artist of revenue.

Then there is what you might call the philosophical argument, made most strongly by Robert Fripp. He will tell you that he can sense when a show is being taped as he performs and that it throws him psychically off balance. He says the very act of taping a show is damaging and disruptive, not only to him but also to the rest of the audience. He also believes that a live performance should only be allowed to exist live and in real time for the people in the room, not in any form of simulacrum. All of this thinking only applies to unauthorised taping (he feels the same way about photography, even without flash). If the artist has given consent for the performance to be taped, then that is OK. For Fripp, the key point is that unauthorised taping and photography is a violation.

". . . and the band is really happening . . ." – what’s going down up on stage
Steve Wilcox introduces us the band members at http://www.leonardcohenfiles.com/tour2008-5.html

--- Thanks to Steve for his outstanding article!!!

I cannot believe that ALL the concerts are not being recorded, for that 'Judas' element.
I am suprised that nothing hasn't yet surfaced on miniova.
g.

There have been so many posts about the engineers recording the gigs straight off the soundboard. I would say that there is a very good chance they have been recorded. I have recorded every show and soundcheck I have done, which is a lot. I am in a perfect position to do that. I would never think of releasing the tapes however. There is a simple reason for this. The tapes give me a professional pointer to the show, I can hear problems that I may have overlooked during the show and they are like an audio diary, the memory is not what it used to be. To let anyone, even close friends hear them, would be unprofessional and for me, a break of trust between myself and the artist. I am a monitor engineer and my responsibility is to the artist, we see all the mess ups the tears and the tantrums. I dont know who leonards monitor guy ( or girl ) is, but im sure he has been picked not only for his professionalism but because he has remembered the old thing of " what happens on tour stays on tour " , that also applies to recordings. Of course front of house engineers are a different breed, neither as good looking or talented as the monitor engineer but im sure they feel the same way. So if people are waiting for an unnoficial recording from his staff, I would not hold my breath.
Oh and by the way, at your next show, give the nice guy side stage a wave and a smile.

tiggs wrote: Oh and by the way, at your next show, give the nice guy side stage a wave and a smile.

And don't forget about the backline technicians.

I'm in Halifax now, immigration officer at the airport when told about my reason for visiting Halifax said that I'm the 4th person on his shift flying fom California for the show, and receptionist checking me in at the hotel turned out to be going to the concert tomorrow, apparently everybody here knows LC is in town .

I found this local review from Halifax:

Concert shows Cohen still your man
By Dean Lisk
May 13, 2008 12:27

He is a much lauded singer, songwriter, poet, novelist — a Canadian icon — but Leonard Cohen’s performance last night was punctuated with a sense of humility.

The musician, a recent Rock and Roll Hall of Fame inductee, took the time between each song to recognize the members of his band, and to thank the audience with respectful bows of his head.

“I haven’t been out on the road for a while, but this is a wonderful way to begin,” he told the audience of more than 1,000 after walking out on the Rebecca Cohn stage without an introduction but to a rousing ovation.

“I hope you won’t be disappointed. Thanks for getting me started again,” added Cohen. His five sold-out nights at the Cohn come after a 15-year hiatus from arena touring and at the start of a world tour.

Wearing a fedora and double breasted dark suit, the 73-year-old Montreal native performed many of the hits from his six decades in the business. They included Suzanne, Everybody Knows, Bird On The Wire, and The Future.

His distinctive bass voice harmonized effortlessly with those of his three back up singers.

By the time the last hallelujah raised from his voice during his song of the same name, the Cohn audience was already on its feet — one of a half-dozen standing ovations the ordained Buddhist monk received.
“Sit down, please,” he said quietly. “We have some songs left.”

http://www.metronews.ca/halifax/local/article/52517

How could we forget the drum and guitar techs, the only people on the road with clean socks, spare cigarettes and credit on their phones... if anyone has info on the backline, pa and monitors, be glad to hear it

--- Thanks to Steve for his outstanding article!!!

Steve-Let me add my thanks, too! Your musical insight is wonderful-I really enjoyed reading this. This is adding to my anticipation!

And, Tiggs-let me add my thanks to the techs, also.

Joe

richardrj wrote:there are still arguments against fan taping and not-for-profit sharing. The first of these is that if a fan makes a live recording available for free and an official live album is later released, fewer people will then go out and buy the album, thereby depriving the artist of revenue.

Fan made recordings are (for the most part) substandard in quality,in comparison to official releases.Serious fans buy the offical release regardless.It's like the hardcore fans who buy "greatest hits" and "best of" releases time and time again...because they want the complete collection.Apart from the serious fans,it tends to be the curious who check out fan recorded shows,if that person is swayed to buy an official release as a result,I don't think Leonard or any other artists is going to refuse that sale.The issue swings both ways.

Then there is what you might call the philosophical argument, made most strongly by Robert Fripp. He will tell you that he can sense when a show is being taped as he performs and that it throws him psychically off balance.

That's rather unfortunate for Robert Fripp,he must have spent much of his live career "off balance",there is hardly any show that is not in some way documented unofficially.

He says the very act of taping a show is damaging and disruptive, not only to him but also to the rest of the audience.

I can see his point in that,but others see its value.Some bands are now reaching out to fans for rare footage to fill in the gaps of their career from a historical perspective.

He also believes that a live performance should only be allowed to exist live and in real time for the people in the room, not in any form of simulacrum.

That's a very interesting point of view,and certainly one to consider.
I would disagree wholeheartedly though.
I saw a documentary in the theatre last year (which I recently purchased) about the American Hardcore scene of the early 80's.They were able to create an accurate archive of events from that era in modern music...thanks to the fans who were filming the shows without permission.
The bands were blown away and impressed with some of the footage that was uncovered.
American rock and roll stripped to the bare bones...on celluloid,forever.Thank God I say.

Moreso,when discussing it from the perspective of live performances being documented from the audience..fan filmed footage has captured important moments that would have otherwise been left to the written word to describe.The on stage murder of Dimebag Darrel from Pantera comes to mind.Maybe not the cup of tea of music fans in these parts,but the audience filmed footage captured the moment in music history where the boundaries came down and the life of a musician was taken while performing on stage.That chasm of false security while on stage has closed,there is a real danger to a live performance and it has been documented for the archives.
I'm thankful for the "Zapruders" of modern music.

All of this thinking only applies to unauthorised taping (he feels the same way about photography, even without flash). If the artist has given consent for the performance to be taped, then that is OK. For Fripp, the key point is that unauthorised taping and photography is a violation.

No question it's a violation.I find it interesting though,that many artists later seek these violations out...especially when putting together "official" box cd sets and dvd collections...the Doors being one (of many) examples.

I know two people who today sought out and purchased tickets to see Leonard Cohen in Toronto.They did so because I showed them the absolutely brilliant (unofficial,fan filmed) clip of Leonard performing Hallelujah in Fredericton,(a concert in which Mr. Cohen didn't seem to be thrown off balance by the cameras and "sense of being filmed").
These people went to Ticketmaster and actually found single seats for sale.
Seats that might have otherwise gone unnoticed and unsold,save for that unnofficial footage on Youtube.I wonder if Mr. Cohen has a problem accepting their hard earned money because of the manner in which they were swayed to attend his concert?

I find it interesting that Leonard's official website is hosting photos that were unofficially taken,in violation..by an audience member.

I am so sad I will miss him. I had been waiting for a concert in the United States. I was under impression he might have tought of it. I am so so sad and so happy for you guys who will experience such a wonderful moments. Love from Boston, Corina

tiggs wrote:There have been so many posts about the engineers recording the gigs straight off the soundboard. I would say that there is a very good chance they have been recorded. I have recorded every show and soundcheck I have done, which is a lot. I am in a perfect position to do that. I would never think of releasing the tapes however. There is a simple reason for this. The tapes give me a professional pointer to the show, I can hear problems that I may have overlooked during the show and they are like an audio diary, the memory is not what it used to be. To let anyone, even close friends hear them, would be unprofessional and for me, a break of trust between myself and the artist. I am a monitor engineer and my responsibility is to the artist, we see all the mess ups the tears and the tantrums. I dont know who leonards monitor guy ( or girl ) is, but im sure he has been picked not only for his professionalism but because he has remembered the old thing of " what happens on tour stays on tour " , that also applies to recordings. Of course front of house engineers are a different breed, neither as good looking or talented as the monitor engineer but im sure they feel the same way. So if people are waiting for an unnoficial recording from his staff, I would not hold my breath.
Oh and by the way, at your next show, give the nice guy side stage a wave and a smile.

Great post Tiggs.I would agree that it's safe to say every Cohen show is being recorded.
That one magic moment can occur at any time where the perfect performance of a song takes place.No artist wants to risk losing that,ecpecially if they are considering a future live release of the tour.
It's fairly standard practice now for bands to record all shows of the tour (audio definitely).

And yes,a big salute to the men "side stage"...there's no show without them.
kudos!!

zintman61 wrote:Some bands are now reaching out to fans for rare footage to fill in the gaps of their career from a historical perspective.

If I remember correctly, the award-winning Led Zeppelin DVD set "How The West Was Won" only exists because fan recordings made it possible to construct a soundtrack for the silent 16mm footage of the concerts.

I record concerts of bands and performers not so grand and famous as Leonard Cohen, ( e.g. Jeff Lewis, Marissa Nadler, Tuli Kupferberg (my partner), and others ( see clairedelune49 on YouTube). The artists really appreciate it, I always give them a disc, they thank me, put me on their guest list, buy me a beer after the concert. I enjoy doing this, the artists are grateful and love the publicity I give them on YouTube. It seems to me that only people who complain about copyright infringement, unauthorized taping, bootlegs, are the people who are trying to make money off the artist, not the artist him (or her) self. And fork them!