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Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2003 7:27 pm
by tomsakic
I wasn't here for just 2 days and what happens? :shock: :D
Anyway, these are good news from Leonard, Jarkko. Also, I find his birthday answer tipically his and full of tiny meanings.
Who's Suzanne and it seems that without her message I cannot actually get what happened here? What got she so made that she left in such a manner?
O blessed are we the ignorants!
Or let's forget all that.
Tom
nice to see Judith F. with us here. Welcome!

Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2003 10:11 pm
by Paula
Just to change the mood as Suzanne bottled out :D


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 2948761136

You do need to scroll down the picture because it is the comments underneath which are funny

This is a current ebay sale. I will delete it in a couple of days but it made me laugh

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2003 12:01 am
by Moonlight
Lizzytysh, you and JF can rest easy. Leonard's heart isn't breaking. Like Jurica said, He doesn't KNOW us. All you've done is create a mountain out of a another molehill and driven away another new member.

I'm sorry Suzanne felt the need to delete her posts. They were paragons of restraint compared to yours. Perhaps you should do a little deleting yourself---over on the "Bottom Line" thread. You know the one. The post about your justifiable reasons and encouraging someone (Suzanne?) with having "the option of deleting your own, or at the very least, your references to mine. Free choice." Did someone (Suzanne?) hold out an olive branch to you. And that was your response? You seem to need a visit to the "graciousness module" yourself.


M, the poster formerly known as Moonlight

what message!!

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2003 1:26 am
by elfra
where is this message from Leonard? I've looked everywhere except where it is.

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2003 3:26 am
by lizzytysh
Hi Elfra ~

The message from Leonard is on the thread, which relates to his being 69, in the News section. It was a thread started by Andrew McGeever to wish Leonard a happy birthday. Other posters added to it, and then Jarkko said that, on Sunday, he would either copy our messages and send them to Leonard, or simply provide Leonard with the link. He opted for the latter, and then after facilitating Leonard's reading them, informed us that he would post Leonard's response to us on Monday, which he did. Leonard's response is on either page 2 or 3, I'm not sure which. People have continued to post their wishes since Monday. You'll recognize the thread by its title.

~ Elizabeth

OK, Elfra, Leonard's response was posted by Jarkko, and it's the last [bottom] one on page 3.

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2003 3:34 am
by lizzytysh
M ~

No olive branch from Suzanne. You've built your case, and drawn your conclusions, based on a faulty assumption. As for deletion, I've already done what I felt the need to.

Judith Fitzgerald and I will rest as we see fit. She's not following this thread, so your references to her are moot. Well, for that matter, even though I am following this thread, your references to me are, as well. From what I've seen of your postings on this, I wouldn't expect you to understand our perspective[s].

~ Elizabeth

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2003 3:49 am
by lizzytysh
That is funny, Paula. 26 bids with the sale at $66? Too funny. Did you read all the way to the bottom, all her added blurbs? I almost quit at what appeared to be the initial ending. Can't open the little red x's to see where the "faces" are circled though. I don't spend any time on e-bay, but this has got to be a refreshing offering. Thanks for the link.

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2003 3:54 am
by Andrew McGeever
The "Problem Solved" can be easily solved: his "sweet natures" refer to me, Jarkko, and those who give him "constant encouragement".
It's the last quote that counts: I spend my life attempting to encourage others. It's called teaching.
Andrew.

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2003 4:00 am
by lizzytysh
Thank you for your serious and thoughtful interpretation of Leonard's message, Andrew.

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2003 7:11 pm
by Moonlight
How do you do that Andrew? I mean, how do you "constantly encourage" Leonard Cohen. I get this vision of Leonard Cohen all alone in the night, struggling over his poetry, pulling out his hair in despair that he will ever get the words to come out right. When suddenly he remembers Andrew McGeever and the constant encouragement that comes from your sweet nature. And with a burst of inspiration comes up with the rhyme for orange.

While you're encouraging people...do you think you could encourage Lizzytysh to not run anybody else off the board?



M

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2003 7:50 pm
by Linda
I am very disappointed that Suzanne left the board, and took her posts off. There was nothing in her posts that justified the attack that went on here, and now anyone who hasn't read them will wonder what she wrote. Very sad.

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2003 9:30 pm
by Kush
People should be allowed to express their feelings without fear or favor. To say what they truly feel - whether it is how bad the poetry is in the poetry section (mine own included) or if they feel somehow that LC's response fell a little short of expectation. Sometimes a person can even change their mind as Suzanne had hinted. But the democratic sytem works by allowing people to express their opinions - the entire spectrum of opinions, not one skewed favorably or otherwise.

Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2003 10:49 pm
by Vesuvius
Ciao Andrew McGeever,

Your reply here was exciting to me. I realize now that Leonard was addressing me! And to me alone! His words "constant encouragement" are a mirror of what I have written over and over on the Poetry Section! Have I not said that I am not a poet but that I encourage the poets? And I do it constantly.

I am over the moon with joy at this reply to me from Leonard.

Vesuvius

P.S. Andrew, do not be discouraged. Leonard may one day write a reply to you too!

Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2003 6:40 am
by Helven
I’ve read the thread today… Ooh! :shock:
I dare say Leonard would gladly prefer seeing respect given, where respect is due, even apart from his being its recipient. Respect, unlike a cd or book, is not for sale.
Lizzytysh, I like that what you’ve said. I really like it. And I like your idealism. (Excuse me, please, the spontaneity and the familiarity of these words) I’m writing this with no shadow of irony, I do mean it. Bright is the world you live in! I wish my own world were so bright…
As for me, I can’t value Mr. Cohen’s deeds, words, intentions etc. at all. I’m tooooooo far from him. But, unfortunately, I could hardly believe that someone involved, one way or another, in show business (or whatever name we may choose for this kind of activity) may be absolutely indifferent towards money… or worry too much about his fans… (Maybe, Mr. Cohen is an exception to the rule. I really do not know.) But does it really matter? Do any motives that are considered to be… not quite pure and innocent denigrate or devalue anyhow the fruits of creation?.. or the author himself?.. I used to think that a poet has a complicated paradoxical character and a great number of motives, intentions, aspirations – both “high” and “low” – are interwoven in his mind/heart (it was a common place, I thought). And maybe it thanks to this richness of his inner world that he is able to experience much more than everyone of us (as if he would live many lives) and therefore is able to express in his works something that affects so many people…
So even if someone supposes a poet to have some “non-idealistic” motives – does he/she denigrate this poet? I’d rather say – he’s a poet and it’s his “work” to combine the incompatibles in his heart… But I may be wrong, of course.

I wouldn’t like to be misunderstood… It isn’t easy for me to choose a correct tone (actually I even can’t write without any mistakes! :oops: ) ‘cause I’ve never been using English for conversation/posting – but for reading only - until visited this forum. That’s why I have to explain what I meant and what I didn’t and so on…
I don’t try to argue, to refute other points of view, to insist on my own opinion. The only thing I’d like to do is to reconcile a little… hmmm… “various positions” (I address this posting not to Lizzytysh exclusively, of course, but also to her opponents) because all these verbal battles… well, they are rather funny… but they make me feel unhappy :cry: when I think of the people involved in them.

And here’s one old poem which is able, I hope, to reconcile and to explain many things.

THE POET

The bard, when asks of him Apollo
No sacred offering, is deep
In worldly cares ere long and follows
A dismal road: dark, numbing sleep
His soul embraces; no sound reaches
Us from his lyre - mute does it rest;
Of all earth's mean and paltry creatures
He is perhaps the paltriest.

But lo!- the good god's voice his ear
Has reached, and from his torpor parted
Is he, his soul an eagle startled
And on the wing. Our pleasures drear
Now seem to him; so too does idle
And petty talk. He'll not his head

Bow in obeisance to an idol,
The darling of the herd. Instead,
Full of sweet sounds, in wild confusion
Of heart, to distant, lonely seas
That lick at empty shores he flees,
In windswept forests seeks seclusion...

1827

Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2003 7:01 am
by eeey
Helven,

I've always been fond of Pushkin. Are you a Pushkin fan?

Upon the hills of Georgia lies the haze of night...
Below, the Aragva foams... The sadness
That fills the void of days is, strangely, half delight,
'Tis both sweet pain and sweeter gladness.
Because you haunt my heart, it cannot be at rest,
And yet 'tis light and untormented
By morbid thought... It loves... It loves because it must



eeey