HOP FARM (UK), 8 SEPT ON GENERAL SALE

Everything about the European leg of the World Tour!
Mordy
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Re: HOP FARM (UK), 8 SEPT ON GENERAL SALE

Postby Mordy » Mon Apr 16, 2012 9:40 pm

So agree, Lightasabreeze and Yorkshire Lad. The thought of a field, the potential traffic problems, the weather, queues for portaloos etc. etc. - and paying £95 for the privilege - maybe I'm just getting old, but it doesn't seem right. I could maybe understand if the tickets were cheaper (OK I know there are cheaper ones, but are they any good?) Why oh why put on a concert in a place where the infrastructure for an event of this size just isn't in place. Kent isn't the easiest place to get to for lots of people. Surely even the dreaded 02 arena would be preferable. As it looked as if we were going to be missed out I gritted my teeth and forked out for Paris, but I really am very uncomfortable about paying such huge prices. I really think LC's management and AEG should consider their policies closely, and hopefully we might have a better deal if and when next year's concerts come to fruition.
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Jim Williams
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Re: HOP FARM (UK), 8 SEPT ON GENERAL SALE

Postby Jim Williams » Tue Apr 17, 2012 11:35 pm

"Paying £95.. doesn't seem right."

Beautifully put - very understated. I would expect sexual favours from The Webb Sisters, "on an unmade bed", for that price.
The lion and the calf shall lie down together, but the calf won't get much sleep.
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TipperaryAnn
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Re: HOP FARM (UK), 8 SEPT ON GENERAL SALE

Postby TipperaryAnn » Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:03 am

cohenadmirer wrote: Either we decide to censor negativity or we let ourselves and our friends express it . I think the latter is healthier . We can choose what we want to read in detail !
Well said, cohenadmirer.
A forum is a place of open discussion, but sometimes now it is hard to express a personal opinion without being attacked in a nasty, personalised way by someone who disagrees. Some recent examples from various threads : members accuse fellow-members not only of negativity, but also of bitching, trolling, witch-hunting; long-standing members (instead of being valued as people who supported LC before it became popular or fashionable to do so ) are referred to disparagingly as "old lags". For some, name calling seems to be replacing the ancient skill of debating, the cut and thrust of argument which most of us here still enjoy.

Thanks for the timely reminder of what a forum is about.
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Vicomte
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Re: HOP FARM (UK), 8 SEPT ON GENERAL SALE

Postby Vicomte » Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:30 am

I couldn't agree more and very well put.
I guess it all started for me sometime around Christmas 1967 and now, goodness me, it's.........2018 and over fifty years later.
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da2008
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Re: HOP FARM (UK), 8 SEPT ON GENERAL SALE

Postby da2008 » Wed Apr 18, 2012 1:43 am

TipperaryAnn wrote:
cohenadmirer wrote:...long-standing members (instead of being valued as people who supported LC before it became popular or fashionable to do so )...
In the grand scheme of things supporting Leonard Cohen is neither popular nor fashionable.

Back on topic, an extra date would do well to punish the touts.
John Etherington
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Re: HOP FARM (UK), 8 SEPT ON GENERAL SALE

Postby John Etherington » Wed Apr 18, 2012 2:28 am

loulou - thanks for mentioning the Judy Collins concert in this thread (check my post in Other Music). I know this doesn't relate to Hop Farm, but the comparison is interesting - £25.00 for a show by a first rate artist in a cosy and intimate London Theatre.
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clive cass
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Re: HOP FARM (UK), 8 SEPT ON GENERAL SALE

Postby clive cass » Wed Apr 18, 2012 3:06 pm

There is a difference between frustration and being a total whinge bag. A lot of us are frustrated with a number of things that happen and by choice I never buy tickets through ticketmaster when other agents also have tickets. It is clear that at times the forum has not been blessed with as much information as it would ideally want and sometimes not on a very timely basis either but there is no question that Jarkko and his moderators work their socks off to ensure we are as up to date as they can help us be. I do feel that in an ideal world Leonard and his management would try even harder to ensure that Jarkko and his team and the forum members were treated even better than we are but that is a matter for them but at the same time I do believe that Leonard and his personal managers have a high regard for the true and long standing fans. The cost of tickets of course is an issue but ticket prices have escalated rapidly for all "superstar" concerts over recent years and we have the right to chose not to buy them. As for his tour schedule again that is a matter for him and we can be frustrated but we cannot demand that he plays near to where we live. There are millions around the world travelling much further than most of us or who cannot travel and so miss out. He will come back to the UK in the near future I have no doubt. I feel blessed that I will soon be seeing a LC concert again (HOP and Dublin) having seen him 4 times on the last 3 year tour (Lille, Liverpool, Manchester Area and Manchester Palace) and just twice before that in Manchester and London at long intervals. Seeing Leonard in concert is not just a concert it is an event bordering on spiritual. The man simply transcends almost anything and anybody else perhaps even with very few equals and only seeing Cat Stevens twice in the past few years has come even close to seeing Leonard. What Leonard is however is the High Priest of all artists currently living. His is the father and Grandfather of them all. He commands and inspires respect from even the greatest artists still out there. He is the Godfather of music. Lets now all get behind the tour and Leonard and the Forum and Jarkko and his team and get planning for the concerts. I hope that forum members who already have lots of friends within the forum will encourage other members to join them at meet ups as I for one really want to make the concerts last a lot longer than 3 hours and want to share a drink with real fans like me before and after the shows. Remember that if Leonard is the High Priest of the Cohens then forum members are the true Cohenites and we must yield to his calling us to his concerts in a proper and spirited manner.
Last edited by clive cass on Wed Apr 18, 2012 4:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Dublin(3) 14/5/12, Lille 25/9/10, Liverpool 14/7/09, Manchester 30/11/08, Manchester 17/6/08, London 1988 or 1993 date unknown, Manchester 27/2/85
John Etherington
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Re: HOP FARM (UK), 8 SEPT ON GENERAL SALE

Postby John Etherington » Wed Apr 18, 2012 4:24 pm

Hi Clive,

Overall that's a pretty fair assessment, and Jarkko and co. clearly do a great job. I don't think it's bad that contentious issue are repeatedly aired though because it helps to get the message across (I doubt whether many people read more than a small percentage of posts, here). There are obviously quite a few issues at present - Leonard only playing one U.K. show during two European tours, the ticket prices for Hop Farm, the number of outdoor shows, touting, plus the transition of Leonard from cult to mainstream.

Regrettfully, I missed Cat Stevens/Yusuf's last tour...at £125.00 the tickets were decidedly steep (cynics may argue that the most spiritual artists charge the highest prices!). Fortunately I saw Cat several times in his earlier incarnations, including the Country Club at Belsize Park in 1970 (when tickets were £1.50). I also saw him walking towards me as I was leaving the rose garden in Regents Park last year, and gave him a "peace (be upon you)" greeting, which he returned.

All good things, John E (brother in spirit and one of the LC "appreciation society"!)
1970: London RAH, Isle of Wight 1972: London RAH 1974: London RAH 1976: London RAH, New Victoria x 3, 1979: Hammersmith x3 1985: Hammersmith 1988: London RAH x 2 1993: London RAH x2 2008: Manchester, London O2, London RAH, Brighton 2009: Weybridge, Liverpool, 2012: Wembley, 2013: Brighton, London O2.
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clive cass
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Re: HOP FARM (UK), 8 SEPT ON GENERAL SALE

Postby clive cass » Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:39 pm

you were lucky John, to have seen the Cat so early in his career but I can assure you his voice has not changed a bit. I will pm u next time there is a cat stevens tour as u really should not miss it
Dublin(3) 14/5/12, Lille 25/9/10, Liverpool 14/7/09, Manchester 30/11/08, Manchester 17/6/08, London 1988 or 1993 date unknown, Manchester 27/2/85
John Etherington
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Re: HOP FARM (UK), 8 SEPT ON GENERAL SALE

Postby John Etherington » Wed Apr 18, 2012 10:02 pm

Clive - I have both of Yusuf's two most recent CDs and the "Yusuf's Cafe Session" DVD, which is excellent. We're veering from the Hop Farm topic, but maybe Cat will play there next!
richardrj
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Re: HOP FARM (UK), 8 SEPT ON GENERAL SALE

Postby richardrj » Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:02 am

clive cass wrote:Remember that if Leonard is the High Priest of the Cohens then forum members are the true Cohenites and we must yield to his calling us to his concerts in a proper and spirited manner.
Blimey Clive, I'm really not sure if you're being ironic here. Where do you get this idea of forum members being "true Cohenites"? To date I seem to have made 143 posts on this forum (whoops, make that 144!). Does that qualify me as a true Cohenite? What about someone who has been a forum member for years but has only made a handful of postings - are they a true Cohenite? What about someone who has only just joined the forum to find a presale link? Most importantly, what about someone who has been listening to and loving Cohen's music for years, but has never felt the need to join in (mostly anodyne) conversations with a bunch of strangers on the internet? Are they a true Cohenite?
John Etherington
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Re: HOP FARM (UK), 8 SEPT ON GENERAL SALE

Postby John Etherington » Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:23 am

richardrj - You might appreciate the "genuine fan" post, I put on here recently. Here it is again for your amusement :D

"Of course, there is still the problem of how one acquires the title of "genuine fan" (a term I personally detest). Is it determined by the number of times one quotes Leonard and makes youtube links on Facebook, or whether they have their own Leonard blog? Is it determined by how many concerts one can afford to go to in 2012? Is it determined by how many posts one has made on this Forum (if so, then my 1857 are but nothing against Lizzie's 23,131!)? There are also those long-term devotees whose lack of time spent on computers is probably proportionate to the degree of an actual life that they are having (though I guess they will have to make their presence known if they are to be counted when they choose the precious few). I shall leave readers to ponder these things!"
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tomsakic
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Re: HOP FARM (UK), 8 SEPT ON GENERAL SALE

Postby tomsakic » Thu Apr 19, 2012 1:31 am

Old Ideas was in Croatia's Top Ten for consecutive 8 weeks, longer than anywhere.
And he filled Arena (15,000 seats) full to the top in middle of Summer vacations in 2010... with expensive tickets (at least for our salaries).
And there is no show scheduled to Croatia this year. And in 2008-10 how many fans traveled a lot to see Leonard?

So I'd say many people are simply spoiled here. Why aren't I shouting that my country has every right to see Leonard instead of UK? So I wouldn't need travel to Verona and spent 500 Euros or so.

The fact is that small venues are expensive production and if not at Hop Farm, you'd see Leonard in O2 arena. I praise AEG Live to making Leonard's tour democratic first of all, as instead of small venues with 200plus Euros for tickets they opted for cheaper tickets and more spaced arenas and open airs, bringing his music to the masses. Between arena or small theatre, I'd always chose first.


I think Hop Farm is very good project and if I was closer I'd like to see Leonard this year and Neil Young next year (as they announced).

Btw I just finished reading of Barney Hoskins' book A Life of Tom Waits, where I learned that Tom Waits tours very rarely and when he have couple of shows in UK in 2004 or 2008, tickets sold out in 29 minutes for 100 pounds each. That was, like, 8 years ago. And we all know he limited a ticket per person and you could not get in without an ID.


So I find this discussion going on these days about Hop Farm very spoiled... And all that talk about "new fans" and "genuine" (?) fans, and that "real fan" would not go to Ho Farm (I would!), I myself can say that I was fan much before 2008 tour started and almost all "old timers", who used to spent hours here discussing Leonard's poetry and work, are gone now (mostly to Facebook), so I could claim that "old fans" are not so old as they claim... I think somebody mentioned word "adulation", that's what changed this Forum since 2008 (or as Ken would put it, "US ladies fans") and nowadays I only rarely read anything, just checking titles of topics...

Everybody's welcomed to the Leonard Cohen Fan Forum, and of course that MOST of the people are silent fans and they're enlisting now so they can buy an early ticket. I don't have nothing against it, who of us here can deprive those people of years of their private appreciation of Leonard's music. We can welcome them and hope that they'll find the way into other albums, and also books, poetry.....

I'd like to quote Marie's post:
Many people joined this Forum in the month of March 2008 and many joined during the subsequent months. You came here for the presales, you partook of the presales, you got your tickets, you saw your concerts. Now that you have been feed, you wish to bar the doors to everyone else?

Most of us discovered Leonard Cohen by happenstance. There was no effort involved. We heard a song and by some grace, some personal need, our lives were changed. Most of us were just a pawn in the universe's grand scheme that put us in a certain spot at a certain time and opened our ears and our heart. How does something so random make people feel entitled? There is no documentation that anyone has to produce to prove they are worthy to be here. The only credential required is the desire to experience Leonard.

When Jarkko began this Forum a tour was an impossibility. Those of you who joined on or after March 2008 know nothing of the Forum that existed without the word "tour" in every post. But before 2008 there was a body of work, Leonard's poems and songs, that was and remains worthy of being experienced by everyone. It is sacrilege to me that after all these years, after dreaming for so long that Leonard would just get a tiny amount of attention from the mainstream, that now folks here would be talking about excluding the very people we hoped would come to Leonard. Do I long for the days when no one knew his name? Yeah, I do sometimes. Sometimes so many of you babbling "tour, tour, tour" as if Leonard is some kind of aging Justin Bieber gets on my nerves. But guess what, there never would have been a 2008-2010 World Tour if there weren't so many of you. And there wouldn't be a 2012 Old Ideas World Tour if there weren't even more of you. So, thank you to everyone who came to Leonard years ago or months ago. Thank you to all of you who came to Leonard yesterday. As far as WE are concerned, you are all welcome here. Thank you to those who will come to Leonard tomorrow and well into the future. You are the people we have been waiting for.
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clive cass
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Re: HOP FARM (UK), 8 SEPT ON GENERAL SALE

Postby clive cass » Thu Apr 19, 2012 10:36 am

Richard, I cannot of course account for those using the forum just to get tickets and worse still so that they can make a profit on them and I also cannot account for those who are reluctant to post but enjoy reading comments on the forum like I did for a long time before feeling ready to post. I have only been on the forum for about 3 years and using the files for only a little longer than that but only because I did not know either existed. I have been a Cohen fan though for 32 years and remember the first time I heard him sing Suzanne. I am of course referring to the true fans and they know who they are but it can never be how long someone has been a member of the forum or how many posts they have made or even how long they have been listening to Leonards music. It is only about what a person feels about Leonard's music and the truth is known to these people.
Dublin(3) 14/5/12, Lille 25/9/10, Liverpool 14/7/09, Manchester 30/11/08, Manchester 17/6/08, London 1988 or 1993 date unknown, Manchester 27/2/85
songwriter
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Re: HOP FARM (UK), 8 SEPT ON GENERAL SALE

Postby songwriter » Thu Apr 19, 2012 11:04 am

Well said tomsakic! I agree with every word you have typed.

I am new to these forums and am shocked at the shameful attitude of the UK fans. Many many countries will not be blessed by LC this tour, and many many have never EVER been blessed by his presence. Yet people are complaining about a THREE HOUR gig which can host 7,500 people! Goodness me. Spoilt is EXACTLY the right word to describe the people complaining about this. A lot of people would rather LC was plaing the royal albert hall instead....which has a capacity of 3,000! So to hell with the other 4,500 who would then miss out on seeing Leonard then right?

I even saw someone describe this gig a SNUB to LC's uk fans, and suggested there may be some kind of conspiracy against the UK! I despair!

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