Cohen/Dylan dichotomy

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Mark A. Murphy
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Cohen/Dylan dichotomy

Post by Mark A. Murphy » Mon Aug 13, 2007 12:42 pm

it is true that one can't mention Dylan without mentioning Cohen, but is it also true that one can't mention Cohen without mentioning Dylan?
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Sebby
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Re: Cohen/Dylan dichotomy

Post by Sebby » Mon Aug 13, 2007 2:08 pm

I can mention Cohen without mentioning Dylan. Um...that last sentence, obviously, is not a shining example of my ability to do so.
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lizzytysh
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Re: Cohen/Dylan dichotomy

Post by lizzytysh » Mon Aug 13, 2007 4:20 pm

When these two great guys end up in heaven, they're going to walk about, arms around each other, laughing down at us... "One way or the other, we kept them all happy, didn't we?" :D


~ Lizzy
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whoever
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Re: Cohen/Dylan dichotomy

Post by whoever » Thu Oct 04, 2007 12:06 am

all right, can anyone explain to me why these people are always put together? sure, they're both tagged as "singers/songwriters", but i can think of no other reason for this recurring comparison. they seem to me complete opposites, no matter how often they are discussed together
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Joney
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Re: Cohen/Dylan dichotomy

Post by Joney » Thu Oct 04, 2007 3:11 am

I have to agree with whoever. I don't particularly like Dylan, don't dislike him either, but to me he is very different to Leonard Cohen.
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liverpoolken
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Re: Cohen/Dylan dichotomy

Post by liverpoolken » Fri Oct 05, 2007 2:01 am

Joney

Nothing personal but anyone who uses a cat as an avatar is most definitely never going to appreciate Bob Dylan.

Ta Ken
Solitudine non é essere soli, é amare gli altri inutilmente - Mario Stefani
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Joney
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Re: Cohen/Dylan dichotomy

Post by Joney » Fri Oct 05, 2007 2:14 am

Oh Liverpool Ken, lovely Liverpool Ken (I love that song)

I think my cat is cute, I'm hurt. Where's the cat / Dylan connection? What has Bob Dylan got against cats? I think I was just put off Dylan in the 80s by my flatmate who was a big big Dylan fan. I do have some Dylan music but I'm not a big fan. Have my credentials gone down because I don't like Dylan so much?
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damellon
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Re: Cohen/Dylan dichotomy

Post by damellon » Fri Oct 05, 2007 2:36 am

Careful Joney, I've already fallen foul of Ken for being less than overwhelmed by Dylan :D
You only have to let the soft animal of your body
love what it loves.

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Joney
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Re: Cohen/Dylan dichotomy

Post by Joney » Fri Oct 05, 2007 2:48 am

Ken, once again you've inspired me. I searched Liverpool Lou on You Tube and guess what, it's a rare recording of Bob Dylan singing it! Just had to share it with you.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=ZDWfg3N4cRA

I didn't know Shakespeare played electric guitar!

Just messing with ya Ken.
Careful Joney, I've already fallen foul of Ken for being less than overwhelmed by Dylan
Seems I may have already fallen foul of Ken then, I'm sure he'll forgive me, anyone who can produce such wonderful artwork can't be that bad.


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opendoor
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Re: Cohen/Dylan dichotomy

Post by opendoor » Fri Oct 05, 2007 4:41 am

OK - Bob Dylan was the 'trail-blazer' in terms of the start of 'folk-rock' (Re: Bringing It All Back Home and Highway 61 Revisited) - both 1965. Songs Of Leonard Cohen was released at the end of December in 1967 (Most references date it as 1968) Judy Collins introduced Suzanne and Dress Rehersal Rag on her "In My Life" LP in 1966. In 1967 she intoduced Priests, Sisters Of Mercy, and Hey, That's No Way To Say Goodbye on her "Wildflowers" LP. (Noel Harrison released his own take on Suzanne in 1967) Leonard himself stated that being away from the U.S. left him "unaware' of Dylan, and Judy Collins in the mid-60's.

Bottom line -Much as Peter, Paul, and Mary intoduced many of Bob Dylan's songs; Judy Collins introduced many of Leonard's songs. The dichotomy is a fiction similar to a person trying to find the inside or outside of a Moebius strip. Both Dylan and Leonard are on the same page, not opposite sides of a coin.

opendoor
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lizzytysh
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Re: Cohen/Dylan dichotomy

Post by lizzytysh » Fri Oct 05, 2007 5:07 am

Even though I have my own preference for my own reasons, I understand why it is that they continue to show up, linked, as they do. They were both groundbreaking in their own way [similar in that aspect] with contemporary music. The way each merged their voice, their music, their thinking, and the uniqueness of their lyrics into their songs had a powerful impact. Their voices made an aural statement that one need not have a 'typical, radio-friendly male' voice, to make it in the industry or to strike deep loyalty into the hearts of their fans. Each had a sense of a 'thinking person's' music... songs to be listened to, that made a statement... not just sung along to on the radio [even though Leonard doesn't mind if we do our dishes to his]. They're both considered serious people, who take their musical journey seriously. Bob writes prolifically and Leonard writes deeply attentively. Yet, each in their own style of writing, they're both devoted to song.

The timing of their emergence onto the musical scene brought them into the public eye during the "Sixties" and they were strong, verbal forces that underscored the 'mantra' of that general period that "the times they are a changin'." A "perfect storm" of sorts, lyrically, musically, and vocally. It seems it may have been Dylan who's credited with the awareness and acceptance that songwriters could also be singers, doing their own material. They both did that.

This rivalry and comparison will likely go on long after some of us have. It's gotten to the point, with just reading it here [as it inevitably crops up periodically], that it's somewhat akin to the high school, sports-team rivals... each fiercely loyal to their own for their own reasons, regardless of the stats and the rivalry endures beyond the graduation of any particular grouping of team members, as they graduate and go on... yet the rivalry remains.

It's as likely as not that neither Leonard nor Bob are interested in these comparisons, but many of their fans sure seem to be. I've given up spelling out my reasons for my specific reasons. I like Bob Dylan and always have. He was the first who gave me the sense of, "Something's happening here... and you don't know what it is... do you, Mr. Jones"... and then I heard Leonard, and he took the mystery even deeper. Yet, paradoxically, they both shed light on and into those mysteries.


~ Lizzy
"Be yourself. Everyone else is already taken."
~ Oscar Wilde
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Yankovic
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Re: Cohen/Dylan dichotomy

Post by Yankovic » Fri Oct 05, 2007 5:26 pm

Here's a little poem


Bob Dylan and Leonard Cohen are both Jewish
Bob Dylan is American and Leonard Cohen is Canadian
Their facial features are somewhat similar
Canadians like to call Leonard Cohen the Canadian Bob Dylan
They are both poetic, folk singer-songwriters


I can't really explain it. It's like Elton John and Billy Joel! One's british and one's American and they both play piano. Billy Joel used to be called the American Elton John.

I don't like Bob Dylan. I don't know why. I find him and his music annoying. Maybe it's because he wasn't the one who was singing "First We Take Manhatten" on Much Music when I was 10 years old.
They sentenced me to twenty years of boredom
ryhme55
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Re: Cohen/Dylan dichotomy

Post by ryhme55 » Sun Oct 07, 2007 7:32 pm

I have been a bob Dylan fan for about 35 years and long before i heard Leonard Cohen's music.
I came across Leonard's music about 15 years or so ago, although i had heard a few songs of his by others and seen his albums.
I have now gone off bob Dylan big time,although i have still a few albums of his which i rarely play now.
As for Leonard Cohen I play contently and find the words that he has crafted have stayed with me.
Leonard's Voice is smooth, rough, tender etc , its got everything, whilst Bob Dylan's has been good at best but awful at worst and awful all the time for the last 20 years.
Manna
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Re: Cohen/Dylan dichotomy

Post by Manna » Sun Oct 07, 2007 9:00 pm

Their facial features are somewhat similar
are you talking about the same LC & BD that I know about?

anyway, when I first started describing Leonard to my friend Leighton, who'd never heard of him, he said, "Oh yeah? Like Bob Dylan?"
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liverpoolken
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Re: Cohen/Dylan dichotomy

Post by liverpoolken » Sun Oct 07, 2007 9:42 pm

Image
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