Why do you post?

Ask and answer questions about Leonard Cohen, his work, this forum and the websites!

Why do you post?

A. To obtain information about Leonard Cohen and his music
3
6%
B. To communicate with others of like mind
7
15%
C. No one else will read my poetry
3
6%
D. I desperately hope that Leonard reads the Forum and will be transfixed by my thoughts
8
17%
E. I would like to become best friends with Leonard
6
13%
F. To annoy Lizzytysh
18
38%
G. Because I'm just plain nuts!
2
4%
 
Total votes: 47
User avatar
Paula
Posts: 3152
Joined: Fri Aug 09, 2002 1:20 am
Location: London

Post by Paula » Sun Apr 06, 2003 12:28 pm

First of all I would like to say I do not harbour ill feeling towards ANYONE in this forum. I like the mix and I like the argument My one and only problem is the way the more vocal of the forum jump on the back of anyone who has a different opinion.

Things like mis quoting George there have been quite a few incidents where the vocal posters have mis quoted people and then taken the mick of out them. (Altho the person who mis quoted George I do not consider a vocal poster) Why do they do that?

I don't like to see any "bullying" tactics which stop people posting. It is not necessary but everytime someone comments about it there is the backlash of the vocal posters telling us we have mis intrepreted what they said There have been quite of lot of posters who seem to have mis intrepreted the "bullies" perhaps they ought to look a little closer at their postings to see if they can locate what it is in their postings that others find "controling"

Hi JTS - I am not a Millwall fan in my youth I was a football fan supported Chelsea and Man Utd. I am happy to disagree or agree with you on anything you care to mention I don't consider you a bully or a member of a "clique"
John the Shorts
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2003 4:22 pm
Location: Wales

Post by John the Shorts » Sun Apr 06, 2003 5:45 pm

Paula

The startling fact that you are a Manc :shock: causes me to wonder why I; a person who spent 4 years living in Liverpool and supporting the only Reds; have managed to get on with you on this forum.

Is uppose it only shows the healing power of LC.

JTS (Tongue firmly in cheek)
User avatar
lizzytysh
Posts: 25395
Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:57 pm
Location: Florida, U.S.A.

Post by lizzytysh » Sun Apr 06, 2003 6:48 pm

:lol: ~ well now, I guess the ticket to finding out who the alleged clique is comprised of would be to address you directly, Paula, and then you can dismiss [or include] them :wink: ? I don't understand how strongly expressing one's own views can be considered bullying. This is not a milk-toast topic we're discussing here. When someone disagrees with something said, I find it more natural than not to address each thing that's said where disagreement occurs. I guess that could feel like being jumped on, but I'm just not sure how one would discuss such a profound subject as the killing of other human beings [for whatever purpose] in mild fashion.

The notion of me being part of a clique is somewhere between :shock: and :lol: , particularly if one has known me since the Sony Board and half of my time here. I have always [in my life] believed everyone has a voice and has the right to express it. As John has expressed regarding himself, I have always greeted newcomers [on Sony] and here, for the vast majority of time, as well. In so doing, I have looked for and found something positive that could be ~ in some way ~ built or expanded upon, beyond merely "Welcome" and in a way that, hopefully, would engage them, as well, the idea being inclusivity vs. exclusivity. Doesn't always work, but has a remarkable track record for doing so.

This pattern became altered after outcries of my posting too much ~ answering everyone's posts ~ and being too positive. Interesting complaints, given the clique concept. However, now the fine-screened sieve that I use for posting is how strongly do I want to say something here; and do I really have anything to add; and have I given others a chance to post first, so my posting isn't perceived as trying to redirect or take over the thread, if my comment is somewhat in a different direction. Now, despite my own criteria, I have noticed that some contribute in a way that meets none of these, simply silly, superfluous comments. However, I don't feel it's my place to simply point that out when it occurs, either.....i.e. focusing on a negative energy.

I'm not claiming to always meet my own criteria before entering in, but I can surely say, it's at least being processed prior to each posting. IN my postings, I have sought ~ as always ~ to remain positive. Some might call it "sucking up," but I feel the world would be better off if that were the technique more often used. Never felt goodwill could be so easily misconstrued, but have seen it here with myself, as well as in other arenas with other places. I wonder how it is that some feel so comfortable being in attack and critical mode with others. I try to always stick to the facts and the issues. I've always perceived bullying as being when another seeks to get their way by undermining ["attacking"] other people's self-concept, confidence, whatever, either directly or by implication, to where they lose the desire to continue on a personal level. I have not seen this occurring in the pro-peace people's postings.

When I am pro-peace and others are pro-war, I'm not going to comment in broad-brush style, and as much as possible, be detailed. David and Byron and some others do far better with that than I, but that's the goal I seek. Nor am I going to talk about it with the same [lack of] intensity that I would talk about what I'm having for dinner. For one thing, I'm being fed, IV-style, a steady diet of hate rhetoric, via the president of my country and others.

I rarely start threads [which will always call attention to oneself, no matter what] and never conducted a Poll, and certainly not a mean-spirited one directed at any individual, if I ever had. However, you may note one of the Why Do You Post poll's options.

I have no idea about the misquotings referred to here. I think people generally try to be accurate in what they say, as nearly as they can determine to be so. I have a penchant ~ adamancy ~ for accuracy, mine as well as anyone else's. I'll quickly apologize and correct as needed, if shown to be inaccurate in what I've said. When it comes to war philosophies, accuracy becomes more difficult if you're trying to convince someone they're "wrong." That's where citing historical occurrences of many different kinds is more effective. Enter David, Byron, etc. if convincing others is to be a side-product.

I think perception of cliques is one thing. The reality of cliques is totally another.

Sincerely,
Elizabeth
User avatar
Paula
Posts: 3152
Joined: Fri Aug 09, 2002 1:20 am
Location: London

Post by Paula » Sun Apr 06, 2003 7:19 pm

Hi Lizzie It is the mis quouting sydrome again I have no idea why you addressed me on the "clique" point. I didn't bring it up in the first place except to say to JTS I did not consider him a member of a "clique". I only mentioned it at all because he mentioned it in his post.

I don't consider anyone to be a member of a "clique" perhaps you ought to address the question to the person who brought it up originally.
User avatar
Paula
Posts: 3152
Joined: Fri Aug 09, 2002 1:20 am
Location: London

Post by Paula » Sun Apr 06, 2003 7:27 pm

Hi JTS The supporting of the Red Devils along with a number of supporters came about by reading about the Munich air crash. I have no idea why I spported them Where I lived at the time Chelsea was the nearest team.

I can proudly say I saw George Best play in the 60's at the Old Trafford whilst standing at the Stretford End :lol:
User avatar
lizzytysh
Posts: 25395
Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:57 pm
Location: Florida, U.S.A.

Post by lizzytysh » Sun Apr 06, 2003 7:33 pm

Hi Paula ~ I wouldn't go so far as to say "misquoting." This paragraph:

"I don't like to see any 'bullying' tactics which stop people posting. It is not necessary but everytime someone comments about it there is the backlash of the vocal posters telling us we have mis intrepreted what they said There have been quite of lot of posters who seem to have mis intrepreted the 'bullies' perhaps they ought to look a little closer at their postings to see if they can locate what it is in their postings that others find 'controling'."

and this comment:

"I am happy to disagree or agree with you on anything you care to mention I don't consider you a bully or a member of a 'clique' "

both certainly speak to the concept of cliques and suggest that by omission or by specific mention that with your "I don't...," there are certainly those you do "consider a bully or a member of a 'clique.' " or why would you single him out as not being one, when you could just as easily ~ and more effectively ~ said something to the effect of, "I don't consider there to be a clique here."

I'm surprized that with all I said, that's the only thing you found worthy of comment. Given the last comment of yours I quoted here, I'd have to think that perhaps therein lies a clue. It also seems I don't need to go all the way back to who originated the comment in order to discuss its applications since then. I also was winking with your being the final determiner of who, whomever considers there to be cliques, is included. Do the "non-cliquers" have a designated spokesperson and/or label-assigner?

~ Lizzytysh
User avatar
Paula
Posts: 3152
Joined: Fri Aug 09, 2002 1:20 am
Location: London

Post by Paula » Sun Apr 06, 2003 7:39 pm

Hi Lizzie - would you please take your knives out of my back.

I DID NOT say anyone was a member of a clique - mis quoting normally mean you do not quote what was said I believe.

The only reason I mentioned a clique in the context of JTS is because he had mentioned it in his post. If you don't want to pose the question to the orignal contributor please don't badger me with it I DID NOT SAY IT This is precisely what I mean by bullying
User avatar
Pete
Posts: 1613
Joined: Fri Jul 12, 2002 1:36 am
Location: Evesham, England

Post by Pete » Sun Apr 06, 2003 7:48 pm

and I was stood in the Stretford End watching Law, Best, Charlton etc.
You may have noticed me Paula.. I was wearing a red and white scarf. :)

That was the Man Utd team I supported but since then have followed Coventry City through thick and thin.. now, there's a team ! :roll:
Pete
1974: Brighton Dome 1976: Birmingham Town Hall 1993: London RAH 2008: Manchester Opera House, London O2, Matlock Bandstand, Birmingham NEC 2009: Liverpool Echo Arena 2013 Birmingham
tori
Posts: 13
Joined: Thu Mar 20, 2003 8:21 pm

Post by tori » Sun Apr 06, 2003 7:54 pm

I wouldn't call it a clique, but something is driving people away, I have also visited the VP board and at one time there were a number of posters on that board. Now it seems very few. The membership list here is long only a handful post. It is obvious that something is wrong. I have been a fairly long time fan of LC, and found his Ten new Songs album which in turn led me to this website. I was expecting something different I guess, and really can see why people leave.
It should be fun to discuss LC's music?
User avatar
Paula
Posts: 3152
Joined: Fri Aug 09, 2002 1:20 am
Location: London

Post by Paula » Sun Apr 06, 2003 7:55 pm

Hi Pete that is the team I watched I wore a blue and white scarf for Chelsea and I lived to tell the tale. Coventry What is the intonation of "now theres a team" :cry: Did you just support them because people kept telling you to go there :lol:
User avatar
lizzytysh
Posts: 25395
Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:57 pm
Location: Florida, U.S.A.

Post by lizzytysh » Sun Apr 06, 2003 8:00 pm

If you want to bypass all I've said here, Paula, I'm fine with that. I didn't quote you, nor misquote you, regarding clique determination. DID, :wink: however, :wink: play off your telling someone else you didn't consider him [italics mine] to be a member.

If I were to throw knives, it would be directly at the person, and not at their back. I have not thrown knives at you. You are not a member of a clique. Nor am I.
User avatar
lizzytysh
Posts: 25395
Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:57 pm
Location: Florida, U.S.A.

Post by lizzytysh » Sun Apr 06, 2003 8:12 pm

Tori ~

I'm not going to go down that road again, Tori, as to why some people post and others merely read. What some expect and don't find and therefore leave. How "real life" determines one's participation in anything. However, I would make two suggestions to you and they would be: why don't you go to the Sony site and do your part in trying to get active participation by others there; stay here and do your part in trying to get active participation by others here. Your expectations to have Leonard's music being actively discussed on a "hell bent for war" thread that deals with a real-life war that is happening here and now and affecting the lives of a number of people here, may be a little unrealistic. To expect that people here and worldwide would not have strong feelings sufficient to warrant their heartfelt [albeit strong] expression of their feelings about it may also be a little unrealistic.

However, there are many other sections and multiple threads where you are not only free but openly welcome and encouraged to comment on Leonard's music. I really don't see negative commentary occurring by much of anyone in those areas. And people are having fun. I don't believe that they come to the "war" thread to have fun. I've always felt that if one expects something to be "happening" somewhere, that they have an inherent responsibility to put forth their own energy toward that end.

I'm sorry that my disagreement with you regarding the war had such a toll on your perceptions of what it's like or can be like or what you are willing to give to help it be like here. However, it does appear that some may have been clueing you in to certain, heretofore, "dynamics." I'm also certain that some will be more than happy to repeat any number of things previously said for your and others' behalf. Fortunately, I believe in recycling, but in so doing, putting the refuse to better use.

Hope to see you continue posting.

~ Elizabeth
User avatar
Pete
Posts: 1613
Joined: Fri Jul 12, 2002 1:36 am
Location: Evesham, England

Post by Pete » Sun Apr 06, 2003 9:34 pm

"now, there's a team" should have read
"now, there's a team?" :lol:
I have followed them now for 30 years... I think I deserve a medal :)

Pete
1974: Brighton Dome 1976: Birmingham Town Hall 1993: London RAH 2008: Manchester Opera House, London O2, Matlock Bandstand, Birmingham NEC 2009: Liverpool Echo Arena 2013 Birmingham
eeey
Posts: 141
Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2002 5:52 am

Post by eeey » Fri Jan 14, 2005 3:31 am

Test
User avatar
Insanitor
Posts: 176
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2004 3:01 am
Location: Neither here, nor there

Post by Insanitor » Fri Jan 14, 2005 10:31 am

1....2.....3....
Three things cannot be long hidden: the sun, the moon, and the truth.

Buddha
Post Reply

Return to “Comments & Questions”