Why do you post?

Ask and answer questions about Leonard Cohen, his work, this forum and the websites!

Why do you post?

A. To obtain information about Leonard Cohen and his music
3
6%
B. To communicate with others of like mind
7
15%
C. No one else will read my poetry
3
6%
D. I desperately hope that Leonard reads the Forum and will be transfixed by my thoughts
8
17%
E. I would like to become best friends with Leonard
6
13%
F. To annoy Lizzytysh
18
38%
G. Because I'm just plain nuts!
2
4%
 
Total votes: 47
David
Posts: 149
Joined: Mon Feb 03, 2003 12:24 am
Location: Chicago

Late

Post by David » Fri Apr 04, 2003 1:47 am

'Waaaay too late to make any difference, but...

If Miranda is still here: I agree, Miranda, that all of us have a right to our opinions, and to express them. And those opinions may well be critical. (And thank Jah for that, because in fact I'm a freelance writer, and much of what I write is, in fact, [music] criticism!)

Futhermore, most of the time I'd agree with you 1,0000000 % about poetry (or anything else) that privileges "feelings" over thinking, aesthetic sophistication, philosophical rigor -- or even [for that matter] genuine and complex human emotion.

But... I think the point some folks were making is that a forum like this is a place where people come with a sense of --if not "unity," at least "trust" (I believe that's one of the words that was used). I think there are different funtions for art, and those of us who fancy ourselves critics need to remember that, and "critique" accordingly.

Kinda reminds me how I used to love to go to the Maxwell Street Market in Chicago, where bands would play music that was sometimes (by my "critical" standards) pretty out-of-tune and raggedy. But somehow, in that particular place at that paticular time, the heart-&-soul spontanaety (sp?) and gritty, back-alley funkiness of the music, the scene, the entire "carnival of the soul" atmosphere made it all worthwhile. I'll be forever grateful for that experience, because it taught me that sometimes celebration of life in all its flawed beauty trumps critical analysis of it. I'd say the same for poetry and art.

I think some folks come here ready and brave enough to follow Leonard's admonition, "Won't you be naked for me" -- in my opinion, that's what a lot of the poetry here is about. I'd suggest that they deserve our caring and our support (at least until one of 'em seriously sounds as if s/he is "trying to sound like Charlie Manson," which I haven't see yet!)

I think (hope?) we can summon enough charitability of spirit to grant one another that.
"Nothing is said that is not sung."
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lizzytysh
Posts: 25395
Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:57 pm
Location: Florida, U.S.A.

Post by lizzytysh » Fri Apr 04, 2003 7:38 am

8) John ~

You flattered me right into looking the key word up in the dictionary. Thanks for the learning experience, oh master guide :wink: .

~ Lizzytysh
George Gordon
Posts: 52
Joined: Tue Jul 23, 2002 2:21 am
Location: Scotland, Greece

Post by George Gordon » Sat Apr 05, 2003 9:10 am

More flattery. Between the members of the Mutual Admiration Society.
Godzilla
Posts: 35
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2002 7:11 am
Location: Tokyo

Post by Godzilla » Sat Apr 05, 2003 11:02 am

AAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRUUUUUGH,


I post because I am a monster.


Godzilla
John the Shorts
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2003 4:22 pm
Location: Wales

Post by John the Shorts » Sat Apr 05, 2003 7:35 pm

Shwmae George,

I don't believe that myself and Lizzy represent a Mutual Admiration Society - we have never met and, unless I win the lottery, it would seem unlikely that we ever will.

I was trying to make a point, albeit as a relative newcomer to the forum, that I do not think that a forum of fans should be used to launch a personal attack (I cannot construe it as anything else - if it is then my apologies to the original poster)

I used my prefered method of making a point (poorly obviously) by keeping my tongue firmly in cheek and then opening my mouth and inserting my size 12 feet.

JTS
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lizzytysh
Posts: 25395
Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:57 pm
Location: Florida, U.S.A.

Post by lizzytysh » Sun Apr 06, 2003 12:32 am

:wink: ....and I , after looking up the meaning of the word, demonstrated its meaning, in my response :lol: ~ you "flattered" me [sycophant being a flatterer] into looking up......"oh master guide" ~ some flattery right back atcha! Mutual Admiration Society? A bit over the top on that one.....mutual fun with word play much closer.
tori
Posts: 13
Joined: Thu Mar 20, 2003 8:21 pm

Post by tori » Sun Apr 06, 2003 2:07 am

I have been doing a lot of reading here, and there seems to be a small number of you that write praise of each other, and totally attack some one who disagrees. What gives? What is the deal with choosing sides? If this is a board "ditto" to the leader has to be your first words and everyone else are followers, count me out.
Throwaway comment
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Aug 17, 2002 12:22 am

Post by Throwaway comment » Sun Apr 06, 2003 2:13 am

Bravo Tori you have got it in one.

There is one mjor culprit - you guess
Throwaway comment
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Aug 17, 2002 12:22 am

Post by Throwaway comment » Sun Apr 06, 2003 2:14 am

Bravo Tori you have got it in one.

There is one major culprit - you guess
George Gordon
Posts: 52
Joined: Tue Jul 23, 2002 2:21 am
Location: Scotland, Greece

Post by George Gordon » Sun Apr 06, 2003 6:09 am

Since everyone was commanded by Jo to "Go have a look at the Why do you post thread in Comments and Questions"; I immediately obeyed.

Paula is correct. I never said I was intimidated by either Lizzytysh or Jo.

Interesting quote from Jo here on this thread: "...and there lies the crux of the matter, George Gordon - most people, not only men, are intimidated by a strong woman with strong opinions - we've all become so wishy washy, falling over ourselves not to rock the boat".

The trouble is that only the clique is allowed to have strong opinions. Poor dearly departed Miranda (a woman) had a strong opinion and was told not to have it. She was ordered to preface her every post with the groveling words, "This is just my opinion". She rocked the boat and was thrown overboard. Or maybe she jumped, I dunno.

So enough of the persecution complex by the Clique.
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lizzytysh
Posts: 25395
Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:57 pm
Location: Florida, U.S.A.

Post by lizzytysh » Sun Apr 06, 2003 6:36 am

Well, I was going to remain an observer here, but is that the way you see it, George? I've had my strong opinions, expressed them, and been roundly criticized as a result of them. Still, I continued to have and express whatever my opinion was ~ strong or mild or in-between.

The only thing I recall telling Miranda was that if she chose to play the arbiter role and debunk the value of anyone's contributions other than Andrew McGeever's to at least do what any decent critic would do and give some analysis and critiqueing, along with her final edict that everyone's poetry and contributions in the section were worthless.
David
Posts: 149
Joined: Mon Feb 03, 2003 12:24 am
Location: Chicago

Click... click... click

Post by David » Sun Apr 06, 2003 6:47 am

I have no idea if my above comments for Miranda were construed as being part of an attempt to throw anyone overboard. If they were, I certainly apologize. I tried to express a disagreement with her approach in some of the comments she made, but in no way did I intend for my own comments to be any kind of an attack.

I didn't read every posting in every page after I saw the original flap over Miranda's comments, so maybe I missed something. But I'll say it now, for the record and loud and clear -- I speak not as a member of any "clique" past, present, or future. My opinions are my own.

If this scene, to which I'm still pretty new, turns out to be about "cliques" and in-groups and out-groups and the like, I want no part of it.
"Nothing is said that is not sung."
Anne
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Jun 29, 2002 6:08 am

Re: Click... click... click

Post by Anne » Sun Apr 06, 2003 7:04 am

David wrote: If this scene, to which I'm still pretty new, turns out to be about "cliques" and in-groups and out-groups and the like, I want no part of it.
It is only that way if you let it be. People can bully and threaten and judge as much as they want, but we don't all have to relive our highschool years.
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lizzytysh
Posts: 25395
Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:57 pm
Location: Florida, U.S.A.

Post by lizzytysh » Sun Apr 06, 2003 7:21 am

Exactly, Anne. People are free to agree or disagree with whomever, whenever, and on whatever they want. If the agree's/disagree's end up being perceived as cliques, then that is a perception in the eye of the beholder.....not a valid assessment of reality. If there's a pro-peace "clique," then I would have to put forth that there's a pro-war "clique." I happen to like to see the reasons behind someone's opinion, so I'll almost always go seeking. Sure doesn't mean they can't have one. Particularly if someone [using Miranda as an example] edicts that everything else in a poetry section doesn't even qualify as poetry, which is really absurd. I didn't like cliques in high school or college, and don't like them in the workplace or social life, either. Never *have* belonged to one, and certainly not about to start now.
John the Shorts
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2003 4:22 pm
Location: Wales

Post by John the Shorts » Sun Apr 06, 2003 12:04 pm

If being Anti War makes me part of a clique then so be it, I am anti war and anti-terrorism (Maybe pro-peace is a better phrase?)

I have communicated, however, via these boards with members who have similar opinions to mine on this matter and with members who's opinions differ.

Paula (from London), who I believe disagrees with me on this matter, and I have exchanged jokes on other threads. Everytime a new member arrives I greet them in my native tongue and wish them well.

I will accept that I have strongly held political views but I don't think I try and inflict them on others (although that is only my opinion - I am prepared to be shot down on this)

Again, in my opinion, I treat everyone equally regardless of whether they agree with me on a matter or not. However I do not like to be seen as causing ill feeling.

Even though I no longer regard myself as a christian (as I was raised) I still believe that the seven beattitudes represent a good code to try and live by, and I do try (Any number of people will tell you how trying I am!)
I try to help others as much as possible.

As I've said this is only, and can only be, my opinion of myself. I don't claim to be anything other than a deeply flawed human being (with a high opinion of himself, obviously)

JTS (Paula - quick question how can a Cardiff fan be pro-peace with a Millwall fan or am I just being linguistically cunning again? :P :oops: :roll: :? )
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