Censorship

[Athnuachan]

What is going on here?
Are some members' posts being deleted without comment?

No doubt the poor moderators are over-worked and under pressure, but I would suggest that more members have been bored away from this forum by the Persistent Purveyors of Piffle (you know who you are - I certainly do! ) than by rare outbursts of withering wit.

[Rodin]

Fluffy cat pics allowed.
Critical comment banned.

[Athnuachan]

Would amend that to Fluffy allowed - the fluffier and sillier the better. ( I like cats. They're very intelligent.)

[Zimmy66]

I'll comment - assuming that is ok?

This is one of the best Forums out there - for the most part. It is obvious to me that is was/is a labour of love for Jarkko and others. It is a veritable mine of information, both present and past. For anyone just 'discovering' Cohen, it is surely a treasure trove of information.

For my part, I have loved following the progress of the tours from 2008 onwards. I also take pleasure from contributing to the historical aspect of Leonard's (and others') work. Although I don't look it ( ), (irony for thos of you that don't understand such things) I first experienced Leonard live at the Isle of Wight. And all tours since.

I was a voyeur of this Forum for many years, choosing not to comment or contribute.

Yes, there are times when outlandish things are said - but we're all adults, are we not? The moderators have my every respect - it must be a hellish job.

It's not all roses though. Is it? There is some absolute tosh posted on here, and I do wonder what some people get off on.

I could go on, but I won't. It pains me to see some of the abusive comments on here. There is no need. I was the victim of such comments earlier this week, and it still hurts that that person doesn't have the decency, or intelligence, to withdraw them.

Robert

[Athnuachan]

It pains me to see some of the abusive comments on here. There is no need. I was the victim of such comments earlier this week, and it still hurts that that person doesn't have the decency, or intelligence, to withdraw them.

Robert

Could you be more specific, Zimmy? Some of us pop in here only once a week and are not au fait with all the gossip. (Mercifully...)
Hope you made your feelings known to "that person" ? And reported him/her if necessary?
Moderators who are quick to censor should surely censure those who insult others.

[Wybe]

Hi Robert,

I'm pleased with your comment.
And yes it is a lot of work for Jarkko and us moderators to keep the forum a Leonard Cohen forum.
I expect that the members can find information here with more or less connection with the work of Leonard Cohen. Of course there is room for a lot of other interesting subjects and jokes etc.
But if I see that members insult others, or frustrate a good discussion I remove the posts.
And I don't think that I need to explain why, be course 99% of the members will understand this action,

Wybe

[Zimmy66]

It pains me to see some of the abusive comments on here. There is no need. I was the victim of such comments earlier this week, and it still hurts that that person doesn't have the decency, or intelligence, to withdraw them.

Robert

Could you be more specific, Zimmy? Some of us pop in here only once a week and are not au fait with all the gossip. (Mercifully...)
Hope you made your feelings known to "that person" ? And reported him/her if necessary?
Moderators who are quick to censor should surely censure those who insult others.

Check my posts from the last seven days. No, she hasn't been censured. She hasn't apologised. The post is still there, and she doesn't have the common sense to realise that it is libellous.

Robert

[Zimmy66]

Hi Robert,

I'm pleased with your comment.
And yes it is a lot of work for Jarkko and us moderators to keep the forum a Leonard Cohen forum.
I expect that the members can find information here with more or less connection with the work of Leonard Cohen. Of course there is room for a lot of other interesting subjects and jokes etc.
But if I see that members insult others, or frustrate a good discussion I remove the posts.
And I don't think that I need to explain why, be course 99% of the members will understand this action,

Wybe

Thanks for commenting Wybe.

[Rodin]

Would amend that to Fluffy allowed - the fluffier and sillier the better. ( I like cats. They're very intelligent.)

I put lion shit in my garden.
It didn't deter the cats.

[Franks]

I would like to get back to Athnuachan´s original question “Are some members' posts being deleted without comment?”.
I don´t think so. I am pretty sure the person whose post gets removed receives a personal message from the moderator that removed the post. Perhaps the moderators does not always post a message in the forum to explain his/her actions but as far as I am concerned they don´t have to do that. In the real world we also do not post every court conviction or parking ticket in the newspapers.

In addition to Wybe´s explanation I would like quote a comment from Jarkko in this topic
viewtopic.php?f=18&t=34127
I think that is a pretty good explanation about why posts get removed and the boundaries of freedom of speech.

Rodin has been banned for 30 days after the moderators had discussed his case and made this unanimous decision.
He had earlier been warned by several moderators after a lot of complaints mailed or PMed by Forum members who found some of his postings insulting and aggressive.
A number of his posts had also been deleted because they were personal attacks against some members, and people who felt offended had flagged those messages.
We support freedom of speech and humor on the Forum, but when it comes to personal attacks and manipulating the words and signatures of other members, that is a different and more serious matter.

I do not believe the forum moderators are frequently and easily removing posts just because they don´t like the post or the poster. I think there a lot of freedom to post on this forum but there are limitations as to what you can write about an other person and I do agree that moderators step in when a person frequently crosses these boundaries. It is no different in the real world outside this internet forum.

[Athnuachan]

Check my posts from the last seven days. No, she hasn't been censured. She hasn't apologised. The post is still there, and she doesn't have the common sense to realise that it is libellous.

Robert

Thanks for your reply, Robert. Have done so since.
Very interesting.
A voluminous poster gets away (so far) with personal abuse, while another poster gets posts deleted (making nonsense of the responses which followed) and EVERYTHING he posts branded as "rubbish" by one moderator! The trouble is, what is "funny " or "rubbish" is a subjective judgment - what I think is funny you might consider rubbish and vice versa.
(I know of at least one other personal attack (not on me) which was not deleted. Don't know whether the attacker was rebuked or not. )
As you say, Franks, there are procedures to deal with such attacks. If they are not working, they should be revised.

The easy option here is to keep the head down, post never, or rarely with sweet comments, and you will be universally beloved.

Can't do it.
I'm with Voltaire on this: (And like to think from what I know of LC that he would be too.)
"I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it."

[Rodin]

Nail.
on
head

ta

[Franks]

So a voluminous poster gets away with personal abuse, while another poster gets posts deleted.
Assuming this is true (I think it is not) then what would be the reason for this?
Are the moderators biased?
Do they like one person better than the order?
Is it a subjective judgment on what is funny or rubbish?
I don´t think so but I am curious to see who can up with an answer.
I am looking for an intelligent answer, not the next sarcastic or insulting remark.

[Rodin]

The answer














.














.










A doo dah dum
a doo dah dum

[Franks]

Rodin, I was actually hoping for something more intelligent than a demonstration of the Enter key on your keyboard.

I will wait and see what others have to say.