How will I die?

This is for your own works!!!
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witty_owl
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How will I die?

Post by witty_owl » Thu Mar 18, 2004 5:58 pm

With scant regard for recent discussions on the possible future fate of others I consider my own plight, as I'm wont to do healthily, frequently. As the horror movie we call the 6 o'clock news informs us of yet another appalling act, this time in Madrid; I am forced to reflect once again on the consequence of belief, dogma and fanaticism driven by vengeance and frustration. Here is another set of verses (doggerel :? ) that found their way to paper partly as a consequence of 9, 11 Bali and so on.
How are we to transcend this psychological loop that chains all cultures to these nightmarish occurences? When I look at the bigoted righteousness in Christian fundamentalism; the fanatical Islamists and the belligerent Zionists; what does the crystal ball reveal? I despair at times that human-kind can ever divert from the pathways defined for us all. :(
May insight and compassion awaken intelligence :!: May the light in the land of plenty shine on the truth someday.
Meanwhile;------

Watch Out Jack!

Taken to the skyway, a madman's heyday,
Never know who may, make another devil play.
A roll with loaded dice, a shortcut to paradise,
Martyrs with a soul to sell, fast track to a cold hell.
A roundabout of no win, delusional and taken in,
Scripted dogma on the brain, precipitates a hard rain.
Hey, watch out Jack! crazy reaper right on track,
Take you down with a suicide pact.
Ain't no rhyme, ain't no reason. Heard the call to a fatal season.

Virus on the 'super-highway' fibre optic data slay.
Digital terror on the move, hackers with a grudge to prove.
Drain accounts by net connection, no guarantee of protection.
Electronic world of plunder, Wall street gamblers going under.
Speculation torn asunder, the devastated smart-suit wonder.
Hey watch out Joe! Where to go? Caught up in the undertow.
Wheels of fortune turn around, stocks and shares come crashing down.


Jammed up on the motor-way, trapped another gridlock day.
Modern world falls in decay, is this just another cliché?
Trucks and cars, all too soon, crawling down the road to ruin.
Choking up the earth and sky, directions have gone all awry.
Profits for the very few, we're chewing on the residue.
Hey watch out Jim! Sink or swim, reeling, gasping, floundering.
Pumping oil and gasoline, tar and concrete smear the scene.
Spreading death, barely alive. Taken on a poison drive.
Rust, corrosion, air is rotten, riding in a four wheel coffin.

(c) J.W. :shock:

Regards, Owl in shock.
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Kush
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Post by Kush » Thu Mar 18, 2004 6:49 pm

WO - I do not deny that I like the skillful wordplay in both these poems. But the attitude turns me off - sorry. Can you write a happy poem sometime or even a neutral one? Not so judgmental on humanity?
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Post by George.Wright » Thu Mar 18, 2004 7:27 pm

Nice one, Witt.
Georges
I am a right bad ass, dankish prince and I love my Violet to bits.
LaurieAK
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Post by LaurieAK » Fri Mar 19, 2004 12:59 am

Witty~ I've already commented on your 'cynical pose.'

Ditto with this. Sounds like a Poetry Slam piece (not that i've ever been to one). Angry, angry. Of course there are many reasons to be angry and disheartened in this world. There are many reason to be other things, too.

Like Kush, i see the poetic gems here...but Gawd, WO, indulge us with a happy poem, please. Indulge yourself!

We are here. Some good. Some bad. All HUMAN (and that is Not a dirty word)...I get the feeling you think it is.

Prove me wrong! :shock:

Regards, Laurie
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Zabka
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Post by Zabka » Fri Mar 19, 2004 3:18 am

Witty,

Although I think of art (poetry, painting, writing etc) as a way of dealing with and expressing the human condition (and therefore having a fair proportion of potentially depressing subject matter) I do wonder if the world would improve if we asked ourselves "How shall I live" rather than "how will I die".

Anyway, that's not to say that I don't enjoy your contributions to this forum. And I don't mind if your focus is more negative than positive, that's just where you are at. Still, it would be nice to see you enjoy some cheer too!

best wishes
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witty_owl
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Post by witty_owl » Fri Mar 19, 2004 3:33 am

To Kush and Laurie, :o Attitude turnoff? Judgemental? Cynical? Hey guys what are you doing at the Cohen site? :lol: Have you ever studied the lyrics of "Songs of Love and Hate"?
I get your drift but I do not accept the cynical "judgement". Human behaviour has a negative and a positive side. I happen to write more about the negative aspects. If you are looking for something more positive, uplifting, non-angry or neutral in my writing then go to "Our Winter of Life" and "Taken by Surprise" on page 9 and "Forge of Dusk" on page 10. If I feel angry or outraged at injustice I write a song or a poem. :idea: I do not hijack 747s or randomly bomb innocents in the course of their daily activities. This act of writing is Cynical? Excuse me but I thought I was trying to make sense of horror in a creative and meaningful way. Sometimes truth is perceived as cynicism.
If you only knew Roger Waters by his song lyrics then you might assume that he is cynical. But when you see him being interviewed you understand that he is really an ok guy.
My personal life is really quite happy and sociable. My poetry and songwriting expresses a different side of my nature. And I do have a sense of humour of sorts. :P

Lamebrain Limerick Dec. 2000.

The old scribe sets his text to the computer,
Thinking, could this technology be any cuter?
But it drives me to drink
When quick as a wink
It all crashes when the entry don't suit her.

Cheers, Witty Owl.
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Post by Lita » Sun Mar 21, 2004 7:55 am

Woo Hoo I think it is great! Cynicism or not I like it, although I always have been a sucker for the morbid veiw of things.......
Arno
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Post by Arno » Sun Mar 21, 2004 12:30 pm

hi witty owl,

I really liked your poem and your choice of topics doesnt "turn me off"...
I started writing when I felt down and angry and therefore wrote practically only "bad-day" poems and songs but I'm sure that once I'll be feeling better I will produce happy stuff too... I just dont think I would be honest if I forced myself to write about something I dont feel...
So to cut my ramblings short, just write what you feel like and as long as you keep the quality level that high, I wont complain a bit :wink:

And I'm going back to watch "Leaving Las Vegas" at 10 o'clock on a sunday morning...

Cya
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witty_owl
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Post by witty_owl » Sun Mar 21, 2004 5:02 pm

Thanks people for the votes of confidence. Yes Arno I rarely try to write poems/lyrics unless I am feeling or thinking something somewhat intensely. Verses should be written when they demand to be written not when the writer chooses the time by a whim.
Zabka, perhaps the topic should have been written as 'how will I die"? with the emphasis on I. This was meant to be an inference to a topic at another post that was (thankfully) deleted. And yes I do focus much of the time on "how shall I live?"
Kush, I know you were giving a compliment on skill of word play and I appreciate the thought. Such skill is valuable if you have something of substance to express. However if all a poem has to offer is "skill of wordplay" then it is really no more that doggerel. Yes?
Though the poems may seem judgemental, this is not my conscious intent. I am really, simply trying to be observational. The judgement that accompanies the observations is a reflection of my own value system I guess. :?

Regards, Witty Owl.
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Zabka
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Post by Zabka » Mon Mar 22, 2004 3:12 am

Hey Witty!

Yeah, I know it was a reference to the thread now renamed "Death of a Ladies Man". Like I said, I don't have any problems with dark introspection, and I really do believe that artists encounter a lot of darkness (no, not all of us, I know) in the search for what's true in this world. A lot of my hard-core science buddies say "isn't it funny that a lot of great artists suffer from depression?" Well, it's not that funny, and to me the relationship is not so startling.

Geez, I didn't mean to write all that...all I wanted to say is keep doing what you do, and the same goes to all others on this subject. Complaints/criticism usually has some merit too.

best wishes
ZZ

What we have learned is like a handful of earth. What we have yet to learn is like the whole world. (Avvaiyar)
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Kush
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Post by Kush » Tue Mar 23, 2004 6:30 am

However if all a poem has to offer is "skill of wordplay" then it is really no more that doggerel. Yes?
Not necessarily so.....I can appreciate a poem with a sort of detachment from it. Or I can put myself in somebody else's shoes temporarily and do so.
I have no problem with dark and introspective. I like dark and introspective. The problem that I had with your poems and posts was that the voice was too angry, the tone too strident. There was no space in the poems for a reader who happened to disagree with you. Why not present your observations of the human conditon and give some space for the reader to interpret as he/she will. You have already assumed that humanity is in this huge crisis and that everybody who is reading the poem are agreed on that point. That is your starting point. But I just plain disagree with you. So there is nothing for me in your poem.

Plus if a writer is going to write on the human condition it is probably necessary to maintain some objective detachment from it - you appear to be too emotionally involved in your poems on humanity. The 24/7 news bombardment is mere sensationalism....that should not be your guide to the human condition.

I am unfamiliar with LC's poetry (except for the ones on this site) but of his songs the only one that I have a real problem with in this regard is "The Future". For pretty much the same reasons as your poetry.

I don't know if I made any sense, I think Laurie was trying to pretty much convey the same message. it is hard to do so via this media.
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Zabka
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Post by Zabka » Tue Mar 23, 2004 7:20 am

Thanks for posting Kush, I've just had a completely new insight into this discussion.
ZZ

What we have learned is like a handful of earth. What we have yet to learn is like the whole world. (Avvaiyar)
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witty_owl
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Post by witty_owl » Tue Mar 23, 2004 5:34 pm

Kush, I appreciate your considered response and I understand more clearly your viewpoint. For me skillfull wordplay is of little consequence if the message is shallow, banal or without heart. Skillfull wordplay with a heart-felt, insightful or powerfull expression is brilliance. Where my work fits on that continuum is not for me to say.
I must think on this but I not sure I get what you mean by "space --- for a reader"? I simply write it as I see it and feel it. If sometimes that expression is (too) angry or strident then I make no apology. I accept that is where I'm coming from. If the reader does not like it or disagrees-- c'est la vie.
Yes I have observed (not assumed) that humanity is in a crisis and I am not the only one who sees this. However I am not assuming that everyone reading such a poem is agreed on my viewpoint or expression; on the contrary I fully expect that a great many will disagree. I'm surprised at times to find some who do agree? Some will find the tone strident and be at odds; some will find something with which to identify and others will find nothing at all either way. That's how it is that's all.
Now you disagree with me and you are communicating as such, hence there must be sufficient space for you to respond as you are responding. And I learn that sometimes I need to try to convey a message less stridently to find identification with a wider audience. But I will still write in many different ways with different tones. :( Just recently you have encountered some of my angrier work. :x But is is not all that I do and I am not always angry. :D
I have always been passionate regarding some issues and some lyrics I have written and sung in the past have been much angrier than anything posted here. :shock: (thus far) :wink: Again I make no apology. I see clearly a danger! I must act. It is my responsibility to be honest and truthful as I see it. Whether I am right or wrong remains to be seen. I am concerned for the future of our children and our planet. Somehow I am driven by something that goes beyond me and my life. What shall be my epitaph? Perhaps I am a fool, perhaps a seer, perhaps just another misbegotten trying to make his way. :?: I do subscribe to the viewpoint that you cannot fix cancer with bandaids. I agree that at times, it is wise to not be over emotional but I shall always have emotional content in my art, for art without the gut expression is no art at all. Your right that the 24/7 should not be my guide to the human condition and it is not. It is only one source of(suspect) information among many.
There is yet another possible viewpoint here. :idea: That the anger you find in my writing is your own anger transferred and this needs to be examined to figure out why.
Maybe the truth is all or none of the above :?:
Thanks for being interested enough to discuss this.

Kind regards, Witty Owl.
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Post by lizzytysh » Tue Mar 23, 2004 5:38 pm

Hi Witty Owl ~

I say write as you will. I've always liked your poetry. If those feelings of disturbance are strong enough to bring pen to paper, let the process unfold as your heart and mind be willed or you desire. The question becomes whether one writes poetry for self or others. It seems you have a way of expressing yourself with strength, and simply not qualifying what you say to allow for others' possibly not agreeing. So be it. It could also possibly be that what you say [so well!], albeit angry, may be pricking some consciences, the same as Leonard's "The Future" is bound to do. If it gets such a strong reaction.... :idea:

~ Lizzy
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Post by LaurieAK » Tue Mar 23, 2004 8:04 pm

There is yet another possible viewpoint here. That the anger you find in my writing is your own anger transferred and this needs to be examined to figure out why.
Owl~This is the ongoing theme within all your poems and writings.

A holier-than-thou, patronizing, unbending critical view, with pointed assumptions, that once questioned is turned back around onto the reader and fellow human Being. In my opinion, this sort of attitude is the stuff of which wars are fought.

This stance (war inciting or not) is what turns me off just about everything you have to say...no matter how poetically correct it may be.

And once again, i have to stand besides Kush....agreeing entirely with his well spoken explanation of that element which is so exclusive and gives cause for dissent in your writings. Albeit, mis-guided in the opinions of some.

I guess the one thing i cannot tolerate is intolerance. That is how i read your quest. As intolerant of others who may differ.

Had my say. Regards, Laurie in Alaska
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