The Beautiful Loosers

Debate on Leonard Cohen's poetry (and novels), both published and unpublished. Song lyrics may also be discussed here.
Tchocolatl
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Postby Tchocolatl » Sun Aug 14, 2005 10:19 pm

Go ahead Ln, have fun, dear. You seems to find something extremely interesting in this kind of games, unfortunately, I must repeat, and tell you that you have to play it alone, as far as I'm concern (just wait that Tom came back from vacation you could play together) as I just don't feel touched in any ways by those kind of things and they are borring me to death, I will only answer polite answering posts to those sort-of-game-posts. Sorry to be such a bad sport. That is life. :wink:
A movie? Gosh. Erm... some of the scenes in that book would be a bit dodgy as film, I think... though considering some of the things that are filmed, I suppose it might be pretty tame...
Thanks Fljotsdale! By this remark, you just make me see on another side! the film I was talking about. Containing a lot of sexy scenes, as well as beautiful poetic shots, it could be seen, after all, only on this "easy" side. Plus there is many songs of Leonard Cohen on it. :D
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Fljotsdale
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Postby Fljotsdale » Sun Aug 14, 2005 10:35 pm

It'd be worth seeing just for the songs. :) Though since I have bought pretty much everything available on disc... I don't suppose there are shots of Leonard singing, are there?
Only just found this video of LC:
http://ca.youtube.com/user/leonardcohen?ob=4" target="_blank

This one does make me cry.
Tchocolatl
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Postby Tchocolatl » Sun Aug 14, 2005 11:38 pm

Oh! I did not mean to buy the film (or anything else)! It was just a chit-chat about the books and the themes in them and Leonard's work. No, he does not appear any time in this movie to sing. Even not like Hitchcock or something. :)
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linda_lakeside
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Postby linda_lakeside » Sun Aug 14, 2005 11:59 pm

Tchoco wrote:Go ahead Ln, have fun, dear. You seems to find something extremely interesting in this kind of games, unfortunately, I must repeat, and tell you that you have to play it alone, as far as I'm concern (just wait that Tom came back from vacation you could play together) as I just don't feel touched in any ways by those kind of things and they are borring me to death, I will only answer polite answering posts to those sort-of-game-posts. Sorry to be such a bad sport. That is life.

What the hell is this about? And what's this biz about Tom? Sorry, Tchoco, I've really missed the point here. Or, you've really missed the point. Nobody's playing games with you. You've accused people of playing games with you for far too long for anyone to want to get mired down in conversations like these. :roll:
Tchocolatl
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Postby Tchocolatl » Mon Aug 15, 2005 3:39 am

Good, very good. I hope this is the end of your bizarre verbiage, dear Lady of the Lake.

But shall you have in mind to continue doing visual pollution in this thread, I'm asking you to kindly think about it twice and read the posts think about the content as many times as needed to understand them before adding any confusion to it. Thank you very, very much.
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linda_lakeside
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Postby linda_lakeside » Mon Aug 15, 2005 4:30 am

Oh, hell, I'm done. I was just trying to get that one sentence in. I'm done. The stage is yours...
Nan
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Postby Nan » Mon Aug 15, 2005 6:11 am

Linda, I gave up on Tchocolatl long ago. She misunderstands anything and everthing a person writes. And then when she replies she never makes any sense.
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ForYourSmile
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Postby ForYourSmile » Mon Aug 15, 2005 2:13 pm

Well, I have not understood very well it of the movie either :roll: . In any case if they understand each other let's allow that they should be happy. Let's not be curious. And let's not get angry when he shows his discourteous side :wink: .

Tchoco, some time ago that I have a good access 24 hours. My problem is to write in English and if the stuff is understood. For the English I use Word with corrector, then I paste it. Probably you will see few orthographic mistakes, but though I use a dictionary, I am never sure of using an absolutely absurd word or that the phrases are, syntactically ugly and badly constructed :cry: . It takes a long long time. Just my interest to say things makes me go on :wink: .
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Fljotsdale
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Postby Fljotsdale » Mon Aug 15, 2005 2:22 pm

I think you do very well, FYS. :) I'm currently trying to learn Czech, and my Czech daughter-in-law (my son's wife) laughs at me a lot, LOL!

Keep trying! I can mostly see exactly what you are saying, though sometimes I have to think about it a bit. :wink:
Only just found this video of LC:
http://ca.youtube.com/user/leonardcohen?ob=4" target="_blank

This one does make me cry.
Tchocolatl
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Postby Tchocolatl » Mon Aug 15, 2005 3:44 pm

Linda, I like you very much, and I think that you are stubborn. I don't really care, 'cause nobody is perfect, and I don't expect anybody to be.

It is not - for me - a matter of "sharing the stage (?)" with you or not. It is just that I have explained long ago - in the other thread - my views about your sentence. It is not because I don't understand it. It is because I did and still not see the link with the subject.

OK, certainly, it is a very funny play on the world, but has notting to do with the subject in my opinion.

Could you just live with both of us having different opinions?

Nan, it takes two to tango.

I did my share of mistakes here, which I recognize and try not to do again. When I am reading posts of others I can recognize also that I am far from being the only one to do mistakes. Only, some people (not every person, but some) would die before being able to recognize having done a mistake and are doing it over and over again (here I want to stress that I am not pointing directly to you Linda, and I doubt people who can not recognized their mistakes will recognized themselves :wink: ).

End of the subject for me, you can continue if you will, but this was my last post about that. Have a nice day.
Tchocolatl
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Postby Tchocolatl » Mon Aug 15, 2005 4:16 pm

FYS, many people do not understand the movie, 'cause it is not a direct transcription of the novel, as the title could lead to think, but a piece of art inspired by it. I think he did a very good job in this angle. But some like it some others don't. Thas is life (I may should write it in my signature :wink: ).

Well, FYS, if you do not practice a language you can never be good at it.

So, in the beginning it takes time, and it is difficult, but the more you are using it, the faster you'll became skilled to express your ideas. Also, some ideas are more easy to express and understand than others, in any language. For me I think that this is not differences that create biggest problems, problems that can not be solved. Only intolerance could do the best job at it. :wink: . The "amount" of tolerance, like patience, may be different from a person to another, though, and the important thing is to know our limits and respect it. I think - I can not tell for others, of course - that you would find enough tolerant people about your not yet perfect mastering of the English language to go ahead. Besides, you are not so bad. :)
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linda_lakeside
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Postby linda_lakeside » Mon Aug 15, 2005 9:47 pm

Tchoco wrote:Could you just live with both of us having different opinions?

Yes, Tchoco. Of course, I can. On the subject of my being stubborn, I'm an 8, remember? I can't help myself. This is my last post on the subject as well.

See you later,
Linda.

PS: I appreciate everything you said in your post, Tchoco, and I agree. And yes, it takes two to tango. Have a good day as well.
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Perth
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Postby Perth » Thu Aug 18, 2005 5:02 pm

8!
Ye Gods!
Only an 8.
Tchocolatl
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Postby Tchocolatl » Thu Aug 18, 2005 5:16 pm

"A simple way of ridiculing the idea of Independence is to reduce it to a topic of money. It is not as well a good way to remember as they were raped. It is better to think that an individual has to be free and independent to decide to marry. That a community has to be free and independent - or to feel like that - to form a part of a bigger community Wink ."

I am under the impression that nationalism all over the little blue planet of 2000 years means being a piece of the mondialisation system wich serves the purpose of big multinational companies first. While ordinary people over the world and here also have figths over language, frontiers, religions whatever, the 3rd dog eat both meals. You know the story : two dogs have each a mean in front of them, but they fight to have the meal of the other, while doing it, a third dog comes and eat the meals quietly.

Sometimes, too often trivial things became a vital honour to defend, when the ego is enterely lured by illusions and - boom - we have zombies all over the place that have exchanged their freedom for "security" (false impression but tastes like true) in power.

When a project of society is enterely based on profits how could you call it otherwise than State Inc.? Tell me. Right now they are destroying the social structure, to make them private while people are still paying taxes for those services. The gap between people who have means and the others are widening everyday, the middle-class is shrinking like by magic power, many children are going to school without have eaten in the morning but ey! All that does not matter (loser :wink: ) Oh! God I want a Mercedes Benz. Cold you said? Yes cold as a cold Turkey. But as is it like this everywhere here is not worst than elsewhere. But I did prefer live in a society that was caring for human values.
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Fljotsdale
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Postby Fljotsdale » Thu Sep 08, 2005 3:13 am

I've almost finished Beautiful Losers now. I'm on the last few pages of the 'long letter', and will probably finish the book tonight.

It'll be a relief. It's a terrible book. I don't mean that as regards the writing, but as regards the subject matter. The writing is amazing. Some of it is quite beautiful.

But the THINGS he writes about are chilling, appalling, horrific -unbelievably believable.

And I can see shadows of the book in some of the songs as well.

The book informs the songs... or do the songs inform the book...?
Only just found this video of LC:
http://ca.youtube.com/user/leonardcohen?ob=4" target="_blank

This one does make me cry.

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