The New York Event in our memories

The New York Event - before and after!
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lizzytysh
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Postby lizzytysh » Wed Jul 28, 2004 6:45 pm

Thank you very much, Paula and Midnight. And, Midnight, as Natalie said to Andrew, coming from you, that's very high praise, indeed 8) . Thanks :D . I am no less grateful for your comments, Paula, which you had [very similarly] delivered to me, privately, before this. As you know, at one time, I'd have been saying the identical thing to you, that I've just said to Midnight :wink: . Now, we're trying to figure a way to travel across land together, enroute to Hydra :shock: :lol: . Thanks, both of you.

~ Lizzy/Lizzie :wink:
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Insanitor
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Postby Insanitor » Thu Jul 29, 2004 3:54 am

Margaret, Lizzy and Paula

I just KNOW you will want to know this :roll: okay, maybe you won't but

The British Blackbird is the same genus as the American Robin

Go Rockin' Robin! Tweet tweet....tweetaleet
Three things cannot be long hidden: the sun, the moon, and the truth.

Buddha
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lizzytysh
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Postby lizzytysh » Thu Jul 29, 2004 4:11 am

Tee-Hee, I love that, Insanitor.......no wonder they're about the same size, Margaret and Paula :wink: . Maybe what you call a Robin is in the same genus as the American Titmouse :wink: [Helven ~ and that may be the same as Russia's, though its 'formal' name is Tufted Titmouse :D .]
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Paula
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Postby Paula » Thu Jul 29, 2004 9:37 am

Thanks for that bit of information Insanitor thats is what I love about this site the extra mile people go :lol: It reminded me of the nursery rhyme.

Sing a song of sixpence a pocket full of rye,
Four and twenty blackbirds baked in a pie.
When the pie was opened the birds began to sing,
Oh wasn't that a dainty dish to set before the king?
The king was in his counting house counting out his money,
The queen was in the parlour eating bread and honey
The maid was in the garden hanging out the clothes,
When down came a blackbird and pecked off her nose!

Are there blackbirds in America?
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lizzytysh
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Postby lizzytysh » Thu Jul 29, 2004 1:59 pm

I remember that nursery rhyme :D .

Yes, we do have them, Paula, but we don't bake them. Perhaps, it's the family connection that caused your subconscious to go for our robins being stuffed for the holidays :shock: !

You're right! I also love how these amazing bits of information come showing up, often awhile after something's been put to rest. I like it that people here are interested enough to pursue things as they do 8) .

~ Lizzy
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Teratogen
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Postby Teratogen » Sun Aug 01, 2004 11:22 am

that reminded me of a beatles song, "cry, baby, cry," from the white album. john wrote it. it goes like this:

CRY BABY CRY

Cry baby cry
make your mother sigh
She's old enough to know better

The King of Marigold was in the kitchen
cooking breakfast for the queen
The queen was in the parlor playing piano
for the children of the king

Cry baby cry
make your mother sigh
She's old enough to know better
So cry baby cry

The King was in the garden picking flowers
for a friend who came to play
The queen was in the playroom painting pictures
for the children's holiday

Cry baby cry
make your mother sigh
She's old enough to know better
So cry baby cry

The Duchess of Kircaldy always smiling
and arriving late for tea
The duke was having problems with a message
at the local Bird and Bee

Cry baby cry
make your mother sigh
She's old enough to know better
So cry baby cry

At twelve o'clock a meeting 'round the table
for a seance in the dark
With voices out of nowhere put on specially
by the children for a lark

Cry baby cry
make your mother sigh
She's old enough to know better
So cry baby cry
Cry, cry, cry baby
make your mother sigh
She's old enough to know better
Cry baby cry
cry, cry, cry
make your mother sigh
She's old enough to know better
So cry baby cry
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Paula
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Postby Paula » Sun Aug 01, 2004 12:05 pm

Hi Teratogen - what is your thought chain on that one I would have gone for "blackbird singing in the dead of night" :lol:
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lizzytysh
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Postby lizzytysh » Sun Aug 01, 2004 4:35 pm

:wink: Y'got that right, Paula :lol: .
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lizzytysh
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Postby lizzytysh » Mon Aug 02, 2004 3:05 am

Really fine, really excellent job on the new pages, Jarkko ~ the Open Mics and the Chelsea Hotel! Stunning job, with beautiful pictures. Thanks be to Lightning for the historical data and vintage photographs. Phenomenal recounting of the Chelsea Days, Thelma! Reading it sure makes you want to have been there [at least me :D ]. So easy, yet daunting in its way, to imagine that parade of people passing by, passing through, on a regular basis. Incredible. You managed to find life after the Chelsea. It seems some, however, cashed theirs in with it. Antique New York City where Leonard did his studies [not all at the University]. Isn't it something how he still had that aura and that mystique about him, even as a young man ~ amidst all those famed people.

~ Lizzy
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Postby Midnight » Mon Aug 02, 2004 3:29 pm

Thanks for the insight, Lightning. But the Chelsea in the 60s sounds like a dive. I'm wondering with all that drug-taking going on exactly how "fascinating" the people really were. I was once at a party where we were convinced we were having the most scintillating conversations in the universe. Somebody taped the proceedings but when I heard it the next day I was appalled at all the pretension. I think a replay of Leonard and Friends at the Chelsea might just have the same effect.

By the way, loved the glasses!
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lizzytysh
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Postby lizzytysh » Mon Aug 02, 2004 5:19 pm

:lol: ~ I know what you mean, Midnight ~ I remember checking out the writings of some the day after; and observing the conversations at the time! And noting the absurdity of some of the things that came out of my own mouth, as well, at the time! [I wonder if Partisan will be able to resist commenting on that one :wink: .] However, what mitigates in the list/laundry list of people provided by Lightning is their verifiable accomplishments. I remember being in situations where the conversations were [objectively] scintillating, when those conversing were actively involved in the arts, politics, and writing.

~ Lizzy
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Postby Midnight » Mon Aug 02, 2004 10:27 pm

I don't know, Lizzytysh,...I think "accomplished" people when they congregate in their clumps can be as asinine as the common herd. Now where was it I read about one party...where Leonard walked up to a young woman and grabbed a lock of her hair and stuck in in his glass of wine and then sucked it dry...and then walked away without speaking. I bet there was a lot more of that going on at the Chelsea than any scintillating conversation involving arts, politics and writing.
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lizzytysh
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Postby lizzytysh » Tue Aug 03, 2004 12:13 am

Yes, again, I know what you mean, Midnight ~ yet, having listened to [and participated in] some of the conversations during those times, there were a lot of things and thoughts being taken very seriously. The wildness of thought connections also made for some irreverant and [truly]hilarious things being said.

Yeah, that wasn't too cool of Leonard to have done that, shall we say avant garde, thing with the woman's hair.....unless it's an urban legend. However, I still think there's something to people trying to discount the relevance or 'draw' of something if, in fact, their being there is/was out of the question. Then, they don't have to concern themselves with having missed anything. I know that Woodstock had more than its share of inane behaviour, but I still know I 'missed something' when I opted not to attend ~ and found out later just what I had missed.

However, your assumption that the inane outweighed the scintillating, I would believe [without having been in each of those rooms] to be in error. Those were very 'exciting' and creative times ~ and a lot of each of those, that you're betting against, was going on in a pretty serious way, despite the drugs, et al.
Midnight
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Postby Midnight » Tue Aug 03, 2004 12:32 am

Well, my grandfather was a brilliant man with a gift for gab and a gift for drink, but he slept off his stupors in a cardboard box down by the railroad tracks...and was eventually murdered by a woman in a poor man's version of the Chelsea Hotel. I just have a jaundiced view of mythologizing a time or place because the inhabitants were doped-up avant garde artists.
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lizzytysh
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Postby lizzytysh » Tue Aug 03, 2004 12:58 am

You have very personal reasons for your perspective, Midnight, and I'm very sorry to hear that what sounds to have been your beloved [as well as brilliant] grandfather met with an extremely tragic end in a hotel whose nature you associate with that of the Chelsea during those times.

I know from having spoken with Lightning that the overdose was fairly high, and the suicide rate [perhaps?] somewhere near, but the homicide rate I think may have been a different matter. At least that's my understanding. It wasn't the fact that the artists living at the Chelsea were doped up that makes for the 'mythologizing,' as much as the fact that they were very creative people, doing equally creative things, and that the Chelsea was a congregating place for them, to live, interact, and make new connections. It had its own, distinct energy. Part of what makes the legacy of the Chelsea be what it is, is that, despite its earthy ['squalor'] nature, it drew and sustained a higher level of intellect and 'being' than the 'poor man's version' did. It's part of what made the Chelsea be the Chelsea.

With regard to a number of its inhabitants, the positive results of their creativity has outlasted them. I can't believe that the results of the life of the murderess, who took your grandfather's life, has outlived her in any positive fashion. The avant-garde period was, in fact, a very exciting time. It was enervating/energizing to the mind and spirit to see people thinking and acting outside the box.

I'm sorry that your view of the Chelsea has been tainted by the tragedy of your grandfather's death, but if I were in your position, I can't say I would feel differently. I don't know. I'm not saying that there weren't exciting things happening at the hotel where he lost his life ~ however, homicide occurs in all types of environments, without changing their inherent nature. It would certainly probably taint it for me, though, as it has for you. I think I'd still, at some point, have to 'own' that my opinion was emotionally-based [at the very least, moreso than not], which it seems you've done in a way with your use of "jaundiced."

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