HOP FARM SHOWS TO WEMBLEY ARENA

Everything about the European leg of the World Tour!
catswhiskers
Posts: 117
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2008 5:41 pm

Re: URGENT: HOP FARM SHOWS TO WEMBLEY ARENA

Postby catswhiskers » Sat Sep 08, 2012 2:42 am

Wendy
You mentioned something that I was trying to get my brain around earlier
" We were incredibly lucky that wembley was available at short notice for 8,9 sept"

Had it not been available then,when we were given Hop Farm as the only UK option?
From what I have been reading here,most people would have preferred Wembley to begin with.

Was something cancelled then,at Wembley,to now make it readily available for a change of venues? Or were the 8,9 always free?

Just curious.

Excuse my thinking aloud--and I would like to take the opportunity to wish EVERYONE a great time this weekend...ENJOY!!!

Chris
User avatar
Mabeanie1
Posts: 2626
Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2008 12:03 am
Location: Warwickshire, UK

Re: URGENT: HOP FARM SHOWS TO WEMBLEY ARENA

Postby Mabeanie1 » Sat Sep 08, 2012 2:55 am

catswhiskers wrote:Wendy
You mentioned something that I was trying to get my brain around earlier
" We were incredibly lucky that wembley was available at short notice for 8,9 sept"

Had it not been available then,when we were given Hop Farm as the only UK option?
From what I have been reading here,most people would have preferred Wembley to begin with.

Was something cancelled then,at Wembley,to now make it readily available for a change of venues? Or were the 8,9 always free?

Chris
I have no inside information Chris but the Arena was used by London 2012 as a venue for the Olympics (and also ? the Paralympics) so it's possible that it was originally booked through to 9 September by London 2012. The Royal Albert Hall is of course tied up with the Proms and the O2 aka the North Greenwich Arena has continued to be used by London 2012 until very recently.

I think the reason we were given Hop Farm as the only UK option was that they were trying to get outdoor venues for all the shows up to late September. The question of Wembley etc availability only really came in to play when Hop Farm was no longer an option.

Wendy
Vicomte
Posts: 834
Joined: Mon Jun 22, 2009 1:49 am
Location: Saint Malo Bretagne

Re: URGENT: HOP FARM SHOWS TO WEMBLEY ARENA

Postby Vicomte » Sat Sep 08, 2012 3:24 am

Only Badminton and Rhythmic Gymnastics were held at Wembley Arena and was not used for the Paralympics as far as I am aware, nor was the Stadium itself. The dates LC is now playing there have been vacant for 2012, indeed there are a few gaps in most months (not that LC would have been able to use them if the management had looked elsewhere of course) and I am not sure that anyone else has been there in recent days either.

So a very good point from Chris. If I was pushed for a possible answer I would say it probably came down to money, something that LC management and AEG are pretty keen on and in recent times, it has sadly been to the detriment of some of the fans, as of course has been the case with Hop Farm for one instance. Trouble is, they know many will put up with it.......
I guess it all started for me sometime around Christmas 1967 and now, goodness me, it's.........2017 and fifty years later.
No one ever listens to me. I might as well be a Leonard Cohen record.
Neil from The Young Ones
User avatar
Mabeanie1
Posts: 2626
Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2008 12:03 am
Location: Warwickshire, UK

Re: URGENT: HOP FARM SHOWS TO WEMBLEY ARENA

Postby Mabeanie1 » Sat Sep 08, 2012 9:51 am

Vicomte wrote: If I was pushed for a possible answer I would say it probably came down to money.
Yes, but not in the way you seem to be suggesting.

Wendy
User avatar
bean
Posts: 107
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2008 4:16 pm
Location: Millhaven

Re: URGENT: HOP FARM SHOWS TO WEMBLEY ARENA

Postby bean » Sat Sep 08, 2012 10:37 am

What a beautiful day :D

Ironically, the Hop Farm would have been gorgeous today; if anything too hot!

However, I have every expectation of an outstanding concert tonight at Wembley :D
Tony
Posts: 436
Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2002 11:39 am
Location: UK

Re: URGENT: HOP FARM SHOWS TO WEMBLEY ARENA

Postby Tony » Sat Sep 08, 2012 11:09 am

'Unforeseen circumstances.' Speculation but still no official information.

'Financial loss.' Definitely by ticket purchasers.

'Rationalisation.' 'It is worth it.'

'Compensation.' Guess!

'Profit.' ?
Vicomte
Posts: 834
Joined: Mon Jun 22, 2009 1:49 am
Location: Saint Malo Bretagne

Re: URGENT: HOP FARM SHOWS TO WEMBLEY ARENA

Postby Vicomte » Sat Sep 08, 2012 11:15 am

Mabeanie1 wrote:
Vicomte wrote: If I was pushed for a possible answer I would say it probably came down to money.
Yes, but not in the way you seem to be suggesting.

Wendy
Why not? As has been stated, why couldn't AEG and whoever else involved have saved the gig at Hop Farm? After all it was money then that was the stumbling block and why the gig was moved to Wembley. Initially it was no doubt cheaper to use Hop Farm than to hire Wembley Arena, after all, Wembley had nothing booked there for those dates. If you believe LC and the management only wanted outdoor venues through to September, fair enough but the way I see it, from another persons position, Wembley sure had to be the better choice of venue from a fans point of view, if only because of the infrastructure for fans going to see LC and the knowledge that no one would get wet during the 3-4 hour gig. So from a fans point of view, I suspect (but can't be certain of course) that the larger percentage would have preferred Wembley than Hop Farm in the first place.
I guess it all started for me sometime around Christmas 1967 and now, goodness me, it's.........2017 and fifty years later.
No one ever listens to me. I might as well be a Leonard Cohen record.
Neil from The Young Ones
User avatar
Kanga
Posts: 59
Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2008 3:45 am
Location: Surrey, UK

Re: URGENT: HOP FARM SHOWS TO WEMBLEY ARENA

Postby Kanga » Sat Sep 08, 2012 3:00 pm

What a mess - you couldn't make this up -

Wednesday - Good news - my tickets for tomorrow night at WEMBLEY arrived safely from Ticketmaster :D :D :D

Today - Post arrives at midday with tickets for the HOP FARM :roll: :roll: :roll:
If I had still been waiting for tickets, I'd have been panicking

Anyway lets all enjoy tonight and tomorrow :D :D :D
2008 17 Jul - O2, London; 17 Nov - RAH, London; 22 Nov - NEC, Birmingham
2009 11 Jul - MB World, Weybridge
2012 9 Sept - Wembley Arena, London
User avatar
real-alan
Posts: 331
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2008 5:37 pm
Location: home of the all-Ireland Champions 2012

Re: URGENT: HOP FARM SHOWS TO WEMBLEY ARENA

Postby real-alan » Sat Sep 08, 2012 9:13 pm

Vicomte wrote:
Mabeanie1 wrote:
Vicomte wrote: If I was pushed for a possible answer I would say it probably came down to money.
Yes, but not in the way you seem to be suggesting.

Wendy
Why not? As has been stated, why couldn't AEG and whoever else involved have saved the gig at Hop Farm? After all it was money then that was the stumbling block and why the gig was moved to Wembley. Initially it was no doubt cheaper to use Hop Farm than to hire Wembley Arena, after all, Wembley had nothing booked there for those dates. If you believe LC and the management only wanted outdoor venues through to September, fair enough but the way I see it, from another persons position, Wembley sure had to be the better choice of venue from a fans point of view, if only because of the infrastructure for fans going to see LC and the knowledge that no one would get wet during the 3-4 hour gig. So from a fans point of view, I suspect (but can't be certain of course) that the larger percentage would have preferred Wembley than Hop Farm in the first place.
Would that it were so simple..... the way these things usually work is that the artiste's management company agree terms with the company organising the tour (AEG) the outline of what they want to do... AEG then negotiaite with promoters to put on each individual show... some promoters may do more than one venue... assuming what's negotiated is agreeable to the artiste (or his company), the contract is made between AEG and the promoter for each show.... AEG agree to "deliver" the artiste (and the contract will include the length of the show, etc., as well as all the conditions to be met) - the Artiste signs a contract with AEG... and AEG signs a contract with the promoter.

So, looking at Hop Farm, it appears that Vince Power couldn't deliver his part of the contract (which would include up-front payments), and AEG looked for another promoter who would put on a show at incredibly short notice on those dates (Mr Power presumably wouldn't be wanting another promoter to use his venue) - so, someone (pod?) offered two shows at Wembley (I hope they got a good price for putting that together at such short notice!) - AEG go back to the Artiste and checked they would go with it.... (probablyfor less money than the original contract) - everyone agreed the deal, and then it's up to the ticketing agencies to sort out thr resulting mayhem. A pain in the arse for us punters, but I'd say AEG did a good job doing their bit - getting the shows re-arranged; The "new" promoters have taken the opportunity, and can hardly be blamed for Mr P's problems... Leonard's people had only the choice of "losing" two shows, or re-arranging... I'd be happy they chose to re-arrange... so, who's to blame - well (if I'm right) partly Vince Power, and partly circumstance.... I understand the frustration and anger, but I'm not sure where it should be directed...

So, it IS about the money - and lets be clear, any artiste touring the world is doing it for the money - but, in my view, no-one made the choice of moving to Wembley just in order to make more money....
you may be right, I may be crazy.... but it just may be a lunatic you're looking for...

blah, blah, blah, blah, blah..... plenty
Vicomte
Posts: 834
Joined: Mon Jun 22, 2009 1:49 am
Location: Saint Malo Bretagne

Re: URGENT: HOP FARM SHOWS TO WEMBLEY ARENA

Postby Vicomte » Sat Sep 08, 2012 10:11 pm

You may well be right of course real alan but life has taught me one important lesson and that is where money is concerned, there is ALWAYS a way around an obstacle. In this case contracts are there to be renegotiated at any time where it is felt the need to ensure something is done to save a cancellation. Whether or not it could be done in this case, neither of us can be 100% certain as to why a new deal couldn't be sorted out. I don't think I suggested that Wembley would make more money? I did say intially it was no doubt cheaper to use Hop Farm than to hire Wembley Arena, after all, Wembley had nothing booked there for those dates.

I would have thought that it was very simple indeed for AEG and LC's Manager to find out that Wembley Arena had dates spare which would suit a transfer and no worries at all that LC would fulfil his intent to do a 2 night gig, so Wembley would not be a problem to LC. AEG are in it for the money, please don't let us let forget that, every time I read that we should be grateful because AEG or the Manager have done this, or that for us fans, it rather p**s me off a little. We pay and they make a nice gain/profit, we see Leonard and we pay for it. No problems with that (I don't feel that the very high prices are that justified but....), as has been said on numerous occasion, the choice to pay the prices are with the "punter".

I don't see why you stated this; The "new" promoters have taken the opportunity, and can hardly be blamed for Mr P's problems? Did anyone blame them? I personally aimed my thoughts at AEG and his Manager as to why they could not have pursued an action to save Hop Farm (and typically the weather blows better than fair for tonight and tomorrow, hope the same for Dublin)

real alan
So, it IS about the money - and lets be clear, any artiste touring the world is doing it for the money - but, in my view, no-one made the choice of moving to Wembley just in order to make more money....
I guess that is aimed elsewhere, yes?

The fact is, two nights at Wembley were taken to save any loss of money but from perhaps LC's point, it would certainly also save any disappointment for his fans that had been looking forward to seeing him at hop farm. Also as is now known, Wembley was available and for some of us who know both venues, it's hard to comprehend as to why Wembley was not the preferred choice in the first place
I guess it all started for me sometime around Christmas 1967 and now, goodness me, it's.........2017 and fifty years later.
No one ever listens to me. I might as well be a Leonard Cohen record.
Neil from The Young Ones
User avatar
real-alan
Posts: 331
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2008 5:37 pm
Location: home of the all-Ireland Champions 2012

Re: URGENT: HOP FARM SHOWS TO WEMBLEY ARENA

Postby real-alan » Sat Sep 08, 2012 11:00 pm

Vicomte wrote:You may well be right of course real alan but life has taught me one important lesson and that is where money is concerned, there is ALWAYS a way around an obstacle. In this case contracts are there to be renegotiated at any time where it is felt the need to ensure something is done to save a cancellation. Whether or not it could be done in this case, neither of us can be 100% certain as to why a new deal couldn't be sorted out. I don't think I suggested that Wembley would make more money? I did say intially it was no doubt cheaper to use Hop Farm than to hire Wembley Arena, after all, Wembley had nothing booked there for those dates.

I would have thought that it was very simple indeed for AEG and LC's Manager to find out that Wembley Arena had dates spare which would suit a transfer and no worries at all that LC would fulfil his intent to do a 2 night gig, so Wembley would not be a problem to LC. AEG are in it for the money, please don't let us let forget that, every time I read that we should be grateful because AEG or the Manager have done this, or that for us fans, it rather p**s me off a little. We pay and they make a nice gain/profit, we see Leonard and we pay for it. No problems with that (I don't feel that the very high prices are that justified but....), as has been said on numerous occasion, the choice to pay the prices are with the "punter".

I don't see why you stated this; The "new" promoters have taken the opportunity, and can hardly be blamed for Mr P's problems? Did anyone blame them? I personally aimed my thoughts at AEG and his Manager as to why they could not have pursued an action to save Hop Farm (and typically the weather blows better than fair for tonight and tomorrow, hope the same for Dublin)

real alan
So, it IS about the money - and lets be clear, any artiste touring the world is doing it for the money - but, in my view, no-one made the choice of moving to Wembley just in order to make more money....
I guess that is aimed elsewhere, yes?

The fact is, two nights at Wembley were taken to save any loss of money but from perhaps LC's point, it would certainly also save any disappointment for his fans that had been looking forward to seeing him at hop farm. Also as is now known, Wembley was available and for some of us who know both venues, it's hard to comprehend as to why Wembley was not the preferred choice in the first place
I wasn't suggesting anyone should be especially grateful to AEG for rearranging the shows... it made complete business sense once it was evident that the promoter of those shows couldn't deliver on his contract (I'm assuming that, on the basis of what I've read, but don't know it to be fact..) - they are indeed in it to make money, and "saving" the shows is nothing at all to do with not letting the fans down....

.. the point I was trying (clumsily) to make, was to distinguish between the promoter (in this case Vince Power) and the company organising the tour (AEG) - AEG needed to find an alternative promoter, not (just) an alternative venue... I was commending them for being able to do this at such short notice, not for their motives... (money, money, money....first second and third...)

The original choice of venue would have been based on (a) the preferences stated by Leonard's people, and (b) the offers made by promoters - I have no idea what offers AEG received, or whether there was a stated preference for outdoor venues... AEG will have taken what they considered to be the "best" offer available, and agreed it with Leonard's people...

my point in saying the new promoters were not to blame, was purely about including everyone involved, and whether or not they were culpable (I haven't seen anyone blaming them)

.. and finally, my closing comment that it is all about the money is not aimed at anyone particular, but the general sentiment which appears on the forum, on all sorts of threads, that there is a sort of "higher" motive to any of this.... none of the people involved are doing this for any other reason than the money. Sure, Mr Cohen has been an idol of mine for the past forty years... I've never met him, but everything I see of him & read about him only reinforces my regard for a compassionate, generous, and above all gracious human being. However, the decisions about where he plays are driven by money, not sentiment...

Hope everyone going to Wembley has a fabulous time, and I'll be there, adoring as ever, in Dublin on Tuesday....
you may be right, I may be crazy.... but it just may be a lunatic you're looking for...

blah, blah, blah, blah, blah..... plenty
Vicomte
Posts: 834
Joined: Mon Jun 22, 2009 1:49 am
Location: Saint Malo Bretagne

Re: HOP FARM SHOWS TO WEMBLEY ARENA

Postby Vicomte » Sat Sep 08, 2012 11:35 pm

wasn't suggesting anyone should be especially grateful to AEG for rearranging the shows... it made complete business sense once it was evident that the promoter of those shows couldn't deliver on his contract (I'm assuming that, on the basis of what I've read, but don't know it to be fact..) - they are indeed in it to make money, and "saving" the shows is nothing at all to do with not letting the fans down....
My mention was about Leonard not wanting to let the fans down, not AEG, or Kory, or promoters who of course are in it for the money, goodness, did you think i thought they did it for love :lol:
.. the point I was trying (clumsily) to make, was to distinguish between the promoter (in this case Vince Power) and the company organising the tour (AEG) - AEG needed to find an alternative promoter, not (just) an alternative venue... I was commending them for being able to do this at such short notice, not for their motives... (money, money, money....first second and third...)
Quite agree about the money...of course, I said it would have been quite easy for them to have known Wembley was available, after all, apart from anything else it is their line of business and who is to know when they started the intention of transferring the venue ? All the infrastructure may well have been sorted before the plug was pulled on Hop Farm?
The original choice of venue would have been based on (a) the preferences stated by Leonard's people, and (b) the offers made by promoters - I have no idea what offers AEG received, or whether there was a stated preference for outdoor venues... AEG will have taken what they considered to be the "best" offer available, and agreed it with Leonard's people...
There you have it in a nutshell, Wembley was by far the best venue for the fans but as I said before, Hop Farm was the cheaper option, "the fans will pay and the return better......Sure they are in it for the money but some where along the line, it would be nice to see fans get a better deal

.. and finally, my closing comment that it is all about the money is not aimed at anyone particular, but the general sentiment which appears on the forum, on all sorts of threads, that there is a sort of "higher" motive to any of this.... none of the people involved are doing this for any other reason than the money. Sure, Mr Cohen has been an idol of mine for the past forty years... I've never met him, but everything I see of him & read about him only reinforces my regard for a compassionate, generous, and above all gracious human being. However, the decisions about where he plays are driven by money, not sentiment...
I agree and have been noted on more than one occasion to state that money is the motivation for LC tours, not solely to please the fans but you do realise that by saying Leonard is tied up in this desire for money, you will put a few folks on the forum in to a state of apoplexy :lol: In the short moments I (and on occasion, Vicomtesse) have spoken with him, it's hard to say you are right on all counts but it would seem to be a good account of LC
Hope everyone going to Wembley has a fabulous time, and I'll be there, adoring as ever, in Dublin on Tuesday....
Yes, let's enjoy the man for sure but i shall continue to put a finger up at AEG and a few others whose only desire is to fleece the fans ;-)
I guess it all started for me sometime around Christmas 1967 and now, goodness me, it's.........2017 and fifty years later.
No one ever listens to me. I might as well be a Leonard Cohen record.
Neil from The Young Ones
User avatar
curiousberyl
Posts: 41
Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2008 10:45 pm
Contact:

Re: URGENT: HOP FARM SHOWS TO WEMBLEY ARENA

Postby curiousberyl » Mon Sep 17, 2012 10:19 pm

Mabeanie1 wrote:
imyourwoman wrote:has anyone received a refund from eventim yet? I have just realised that I have a new debit card (with a new card number) since I booked the tickets and am now concerned that this will pose a problem if eventim try and send the refund back to the original card number....
There's no refund showing on my credit card account yet. Eventim said 5 working days which takes them to tomorrow and my guess is that they'll process the refunds at the latest possible moment.

If your new debit card replaces an older card issued by the same bank and relating to the same account, the refund should find its way to you without any problems. If it's for a completely new account, I suggest you call Eventim Customer Services as soon as possible and explain the potential problem. It may be that the electronic transactions to process the refunds have been set up by now but it's worth a go to see if you can sort it out in advance.

Wendy
We have a completely new account due to card being lost & reissued with a new account number. Have contacted eventim on numerous occasions. They promised they wouldn't send the money to the old account, then sent an email confirming that they had. On receipt of the email I rang them and they reassured me that the money hadn't actually been sent, but was "in a queue" (what... At Wembley Arena like the rest of us?) and could be recalled.... My request to have the payment redirect was noted and I would receive a Phonecall..... I didn't. I did receive an email saying that my payment had been accepted by my bank. I rang them again to say it was the wrong account... It's still not in my new account, eventim still haven't rung me.... I'm still £200 short....
Barbara



Dublin 1988
London O2 2008 x 2
Weybridge 2009
London Wembley Arena 2012
User avatar
curiousberyl
Posts: 41
Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2008 10:45 pm
Contact:

Re: URGENT: HOP FARM SHOWS TO WEMBLEY ARENA

Postby curiousberyl » Mon Sep 17, 2012 10:46 pm

John Etherington wrote:Wembley is by no means my favourite venue, with the trek from Wembley Park Station to the arena (and first-timers - note that it's the arena, NOT the Stadium). However, I saw Bob Dylan there, a few years ago, and they have improved the surrounding area and the intererior area where the loos, bars, and (junk) food stands are.
Loos?? Where??? As far as I could see, there were 7 between all of us ladies!
Barbara



Dublin 1988
London O2 2008 x 2
Weybridge 2009
London Wembley Arena 2012
User avatar
curiousberyl
Posts: 41
Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2008 10:45 pm
Contact:

Re: URGENT: HOP FARM SHOWS TO WEMBLEY ARENA

Postby curiousberyl » Mon Sep 17, 2012 11:17 pm

Lorca1999 wrote:Getting very excited about tomorrow :D

Just a head up - a highlight for me in Ghent was Alexandra Leaving, sung entirely by Sharon.
It was absolutely mesmerising, so if it starts, don't get up and go for a wee, or take photos, just enjoy :D :D

x
She had me in tears, completely wonderful. :)
Barbara



Dublin 1988
London O2 2008 x 2
Weybridge 2009
London Wembley Arena 2012

Return to “Old Ideas World Tour 2012 / Europe”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests